Ceroc Scotland Forum - View Single Post

**DavidB** · 9th-December-2002, 01:43 PM

Definition
I still haven't found a decent definition of Modern Jive. The best I can come up with is:
"Modern Jive is a lead-follow partner dance, based around a combination of simple 2-count walked steps. There is no fixed footwork, and virtually any variations can and do get used. The timing emphasises the downbeat, with the lead on the upbeat. Most leads are hand-to-hand, in an open position. The dance is usually circular, as opposed to being slotted, and typically there is movement from both the leader and the follower."

(The US Swing Dance Server describes it as: "The French form of the dance, where there is NO footwork, so it's very easy. These make up for that by doing very complex 6/8 beat moves with the arms. Looks very good for a while, but is mechanical, and contains little expression. ")

Is Ceroc a dance.
Sorry - no. I would only consider it to be THE name for the dance if:
- non-Cerocers only used the name Ceroc, and no other name.
- only Ceroc taught it at the beginning, and for the first few years
- Ceroc took it to an established dance body and asked for it to be formalised.
- Ceroc allowed the name to be used by anyone else

I know Ceroc didn't invented the dance. The only common theme to any of the claims are that it started in France, not London. The first people to teach it (whoever they are) learned it in France. It seems to have its roots in the single-step swing of the '60s, and the 3 & 4 count hustle & Disco-fox if the '70s. Ceroc might have helped develop the dance in the early years, but not recently. (Sorry - I don't think of new combinations of moves is 'developing' the dance.)

But Ceroc is definitely a major influence on Modern Jive. They are the largest organisation that teach Jive. They have standardised the teaching, and introduced different combinations of moves. They have set up a large number of classes around the country. Most importantly they have got a huge number of people dancing, and enjoying it.

Is Ceroc a style?
To me that means you have to be able to recognise a distinct difference between people who have only done Ceroc classes, compared to those who have learned another style of Modern Jive (from a non-Ceroc teacher!)

David

PS Ceroc did not invent good teaching, or simplifying dancing, or including other dance styles, or stringing together moves. They do not have a monopoly on teaching non-dancers to have fun, or dancing to a range of musical styles & tempos. Jive is not the only dance where you don't have to do footwork, or can improvise.

9th-December-2002, 01:43 PM	#18 (permalink)
DavidB The Oracle Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 2,140 Status: working too hard Rep Power: 5 Rep.: 1437	Definition I still haven't found a decent definition of Modern Jive. The best I can come up with is: "Modern Jive is a lead-follow partner dance, based around a combination of simple 2-count walked steps. There is no fixed footwork, and virtually any variations can and do get used. The timing emphasises the downbeat, with the lead on the upbeat. Most leads are hand-to-hand, in an open position. The dance is usually circular, as opposed to being slotted, and typically there is movement from both the leader and the follower." (The US Swing Dance Server describes it as: "The French form of the dance, where there is NO footwork, so it's very easy. These make up for that by doing very complex 6/8 beat moves with the arms. Looks very good for a while, but is mechanical, and contains little expression. ") Is Ceroc a dance. Sorry - no. I would only consider it to be THE name for the dance if: - non-Cerocers only used the name Ceroc, and no other name. - only Ceroc taught it at the beginning, and for the first few years - Ceroc took it to an established dance body and asked for it to be formalised. - Ceroc allowed the name to be used by anyone else I know Ceroc didn't invented the dance. The only common theme to any of the claims are that it started in France, not London. The first people to teach it (whoever they are) learned it in France. It seems to have its roots in the single-step swing of the '60s, and the 3 & 4 count hustle & Disco-fox if the '70s. Ceroc might have helped develop the dance in the early years, but not recently. (Sorry - I don't think of new combinations of moves is 'developing' the dance.) But Ceroc is definitely a major influence on Modern Jive. They are the largest organisation that teach Jive. They have standardised the teaching, and introduced different combinations of moves. They have set up a large number of classes around the country. Most importantly they have got a huge number of people dancing, and enjoying it. Is Ceroc a style? To me that means you have to be able to recognise a distinct difference between people who have only done Ceroc classes, compared to those who have learned another style of Modern Jive (from a non-Ceroc teacher!) David PS Ceroc did not invent good teaching, or simplifying dancing, or including other dance styles, or stringing together moves. They do not have a monopoly on teaching non-dancers to have fun, or dancing to a range of musical styles & tempos. Jive is not the only dance where you don't have to do footwork, or can improvise.