Tips for (beginner) Guys

[Gary]

I'm going to start teaching beginner revision/consolidation/freestyle classes soon. I'd like to be able to hand out a short list of tips for guys getting started with MJ. I'd appreciate feedback on what I've got so far. I'm obviously leaving out lots and generalising wildly, but I'm wanting to keep the list short, in the hopes of not overwhelming the guys (any more than they already are). It's mostly based on taking what I've heard girls complain about, and turning those things around into positives.

Anyway, here it is:

Gary's Tips for Guys

1. Protect your partner! If she gets bumped, stepped on, or dropped, it is your fault. Be alert, be careful.

2. Remember hygiene. Shower before class. Bring spare shirts, towel. Use toothbrush/mints/whatever. Wash and dry your hands after using the bathroom.

3. Smile, relax, have fun. Even if you're not relaxed or having fun, smile.

4. Take responsibility. You're leading -- if a move doesn't work, it's your fault. Get help (from the girl or a teacher) on how to lead it better. Concentrate on your leading, don't try to teach the girl what she "should" be doing.

5. Find the beat. Practice every time you hear music. Find the on-beat/off-beat. Learn where you are in the 8-count.

6. Hang in there. The first six to ten weeks are very challenging. It gets lots easier. Aim to learn one move each week. With six moves, you can freestyle.

7. Get feedback. Ask "how's my tension? did that feel awkward? too rough? too unclear?". Don't get offended or defensive (or you won't get any more feedback). If she thinks it was too rough, it was too rough. Always get at least one dance with the dance guide, and ask for feedback.

8. Practice lots. You need repetition to get moves into muscle memory. If you don't know many moves, just practice the ones you know. If you dance one song each with every girl in the room, you've gotten lots of practice and not bored anyone too much. If you follow tips 1-5, girls won't mind (for one song) that you don't know many moves.

9. Write moves down. Look over the list occasionally. Before dancing choose the move(s) you'll work on in freestyle ("I'll practice the Pretzel this week"). Beginner videos/DVDs can be fantastic when you know moves but need to be reminded of them.

10. Don't be too timid. Some moves require good contact through the body. If you're concentrating on the dance, the girl will know. If you're feeling sleazy, leave now, go to a bar or something.

11. Help beginners. Remember how grateful you are now to intermediate/advanced girls who help you by dancing with you. Return the favour by dancing (gently) with beginner girls once you're a rockstar dancer (and while you're on the way).

12. (Advanced tip): Listen to the music. Make your moves/styling/timing fit in with what the music is saying. It'll be at least a few months before you have enough space in your head to think about this, but start listening to what the music is suggesting as soon as you can.

[Gadget]

Not a bad list , but personally I think that your order is wrong, and that several "rules" could be combined into one. {You may also find some usefull tips under the "Beginner" section of this forum }

3. Smile, relax, have fun. this should be first on the list - if you're not having fun, then you're not dancing.

6. Hang in there. 8. Practice lots. I don't agree with the text under 6, but I do agree with the sentiment. I also think that a "Don't stop dancing" should be included in this rule - if you screw up, if your partner does something unexpected, if you can't remember what to do... don't stop!. It helps develop freestyle instincts and quicky releases you from the "panic mode" areas of dancing. I would also include something about asking as many (different) people to dance as you can and to only refuse if you have good reason.

4. Take responsibility. 1. Protect your partner! One and the same thing - and it applies to both lead and follower - you both should watch out for each other and be responsable for your own safety (esp in 'advanced' moves)

These are the only rules I would introduce beginners to, with a footnote of 2. Remember hygiene. including a "dance bag" and "shoes" bit.


For "improvers" (ie beginners beyond the first couple of weeks) I would probably expand on these and include the next set of "tips" to improve their dancing...

9. Write moves down. It works for some people, but just as valid are watching other dancers and watching videos. This is more of an expansion on the "Practice" rule - no point in writing moves down if you don't practice them or use them again once you've recorded them.

5. Find the beat. 12. (Advanced tip): Listen to the music. again I'm not sure I agree with the text, but the idea of listening to the music and being aware of it is sound.

7. Get feedback. I think that this should only be done for one or two dances in an evening, or only at the end of a dance: worrying about "am i doing this right/that right" is more liable to produce less confident dancers. Personally I think that the only "feedback" dances should be with teachers or taxis.

10. Don't be too timid. Again, I'm not convinced of the wording, and I would expand it into "be aware of yourself": knowing where your arms are, your legs are, your centre of gravity is, etceteras enables you to move better and respond quicker. Possably a few little tips here like keep your knees slightly bent, esp on turns" and "don't take too big a step back - use your body to give the illusion of distance if necissary" may be included.


I would only mention 11. Help beginners. as "Remember how your are dancing now" as a footnote - not really a tip; just a courtesy.

I also notice that you are preaching only to leads - all the points above are applicable to followers as well (I think).

[ChrisA]

Originally posted by Gadget
"3. Smile, relax, have fun." should be first on the list - if you're not having fun, then you're not dancing.

Well, FWIW, I thought Gary's list was pretty good.

I particularly disagree with Gadget's point here - if I had a quid for every person I wanted to smack because they told me to relax and have fun - without telling me how I could - I would be much better off than I am. And I didn't have fun dancing for ages after I started (though I was enjoying the learning) - so being told I wasn't dancing cos I wasn't having fun would have put me right off and made it even harder to get my head round it all.

Sometimes it's possible to do better by consciously relaxing some part of you - like the traditional beginners armjive that ends up at neck level because they're tense.

But if you're not feeling relaxed - and plenty of beginners aren't, you can't suddenly become relaxed any more than telling a clinical depressive to "snap out of it" is a particularly cool "treatment"

As I say, relaxing a part of your body that has become too tense can be very useful, but this is usually a product of un underlying tension which is not so easy to get rid of..

The relaxation comes when you know what you're doing, and doing it becomes easier and easier.

It is also possible to be encouraged to feel a bit more Ok about not being relaxed and/or feeling/looking crap by being reassured that it's perfectly normal at the beginning, and as Gary says, to hang in there.

Gary's tips IMHO will be helpful for this, and get ground rules laid down nice and early. So good on him for that.

Chris

[Gadget]

Originally posted by ChrisA
Well, FWIW, I thought Gary's list was pretty good.

I agree; it's a good list - I haven't really added anything to it: a good first draught. I just think that it needs a bit re-wording and polish (...in my opinion - which is often vastly different from everyone elses )

I particularly disagree with Gadget's point here...~snip~

Thinking on it more; you're right - you can only really start to have "fun" when you relax into it. You can still enjoy dancing and learning how, but I think that the enjoyment increases dramatically when the fear of doing something wrong and tenseness eases from the dancer.
Perhaps a seperate "tips" section on how to relax would be worthwhile?

{and I still think that the "fun" aspect should be No1 on the list, but you have to r e l a x first.}

[ChrisA]

Originally posted by Gadget
Perhaps a separate "tips" section on how to relax would be worthwhile?

Yep. It would sure help me...

[Rachel]

Ooh excellent! Would you mind if I sabotaged your thread just a little to name some personal gripes (sorry, tips)?

I say sabotage, because the things below are not really suitable for a beginners' tips list - although the vast majority do apply to new dancers. And also, I don't generally like lists of negative instructions i.e. don't do this, don't do that … (which, I'm afraid, is exactly what I've done here!)

But it's just things which I wish I could say to guys, and usually don't dare …. Though I by no means wish to sound as if I'm complaining - I'd certainly welcome hints and tips (ok, gripes and grievances) that leaders may want to give to followers.

- Bear in mind that a lady can have an excellent dance with just beginner moves. Don't worry about trying to do a huge variety of moves, or particularly complicated moves, before you're comfortable with leading the basics.

- Try and keep your hands and arms steady, in order to be able to give a clear lead to the lady. Keep your arms low, unless you're leading a move that requires a shoulder- or head-level lead.

- Don't lead with the shoulders - try and lose the tension in your neck and shoulders. Most leading can be done with a gentle hand and steady arm.

- You usually have much more time than you think - don't rush through moves and get ahead of the music.

- If you think you're behind the music, don't grab onto or snatch at the lady's hand in an attempt to catch up. If necessary, slow the move down and catch the next beat/phrase.

- Don't move in constant clockwise circles throughout the entire dance. Also, focus on the front/back or side walls, and try to end up facing one of them at the end of each move.

- Don't start the lady spinning, and then move away to begin your next move. It can be pretty hard for her to locate you again if you've changed position. Wait in front of the lady until she has finished her spin and is facing you again.

- If you're constantly taking big steps or moving round in circles and the lady is having trouble making contact, please don't say, 'Where were you?'

- Don't shove a lady into a spin twice as hard, and tell her she's going to do a double. This will usually just send her off balance.

- If a lady didn't manage to do a move as you'd expected, please don't stop the dance to tell her how to do it correctly. If you wish to do that, wait until the end of the dance.

- It's quite distracting to hear a running commentry throughout the dance, telling her what move you're going to do next. Most moves should be leadable without verbal assistance.

- Pleeeese don't say: 'Now give me a sexy walk …'/'Now do this sexily …'

- Please don't chew gum when you're dancing. Particularly if you're doing moves where you position your head close to the lady's, and all she can hear is your chewing!

Oops, sorry this has turned into such a big list! As I said, I don't want to sound as if I'm moaning. Most guys are wonderful to dance with. It's just that these same things keep coming into my head time and time again.

Any good tips for followers, then?
Rachel

[TheTramp]

Originally posted by Rachel
Any good tips for followers, then?

Follow!

Trampy

[Aleks]

Originally posted by TheTramp
Follow!

Trampy

Any chance you could expand on that please?

[ChrisA]

Originally posted by Rachel
- Pleeeese don't say: 'Now give me a sexy walk …'/'Now do this sexily …'

Oh. My. God.

Are there really muppets out there that do this.....

....




Chris

PS Fab list, Rachel

[TheTramp]

Originally posted by Aleks
Any chance you could expand on that please?

Follow the man who's leading you

Trampy

[TheTramp]

There go my dances tonight

Steve

[Franck]

Originally posted by Gary
I'm going to start teaching beginner revision/consolidation/freestyle classes soon. I'd like to be able to hand out a short list of tips for guys getting started with MJ. I'd appreciate feedback on what I've got so far.

Great idea and great list so far. I like some of the extra points that Rachel added too.

I would only add one more tip for Freestyle Beginners.

- Pick a couple of moves you can lead / dance well and use them as the foundation for your freestyle, don't be afraid to repeat them often, and use them as fall-back moves when you panic and can't think of anything else. Only add one or 2 new moves (from the class) peridically through the dance in-between your foundation moves.
Good foundation moves are the Manspin (or shoulder slide), the First Move, the Armjive and the In & Out...

[Jayne]

Originally posted by ChrisA
PS Fab list, Rachel

Agreed! This list sounds like the kind of thing that should have been put together over a bottle of wine.....

My only comment would be about chewing gum. Does this bug people? I chew gum *all* the time, especially when dancing. I'm completely paranoid about bad breath and my mouth gets soo dry when I dance if I don't chew. I know that loud chewing is disgusting - but is it worse than the alternative???

J

[Franck]

Originally posted by Aleks
Any chance you could expand on that please?

Best advice I can think of for Followers is follow your Right-hand... wherever it goes you go, whenever it stops you stop.

Other useful bits of info are:

- Rely less on the man pulling / pushing for travel, take responsibility for your own momentum.

- Smile and encourage the man leading you, you will increase his confidence and make him a better dancer (yes, even if he is a Beginner and can only dance 2 moves, praise what you can... )

[TheTramp]

Originally posted by Franck
yes, even if he is a Beginner and can only dance 2 moves, praise what you can...

Exactly!!!

Trampy

[Jooles]

I think both Gary's list and Rachel's lists are excellent, particularly number four on Gary's.

I never understand why guys think that if you don't know what move you are being led into the first time they attempt it, you will get it the second, third or fourth time they try it. In the meantime your arm has been bent out of shape and instructions are being shouted in your ear and what was a good dance has turned into an experience you want to walk away from.

I've particularly noted with these men that they never assume it is their fault for not being able to lead the move properly. They always make you feel as if your standard of dancing is just not adequate.

I find that dancing with a really good dancer is not only great becasue they dance well, but because they are far more likely to smile when something goes wrong.

Okay.....end of rant!!!!

[Chicklet]

Originally posted by TheTramp
Exactly!!!

Trampy

Steve I don't think it applies to beginners that get caught dancing to 1.5 minutes of Dance the Night Away

[TheTramp]

Originally posted by Chicklet
Steve I don't think it applies to beginners that get caught dancing to 1.5 minutes of Dance the Night Away

It wasn't that long.

I danced to it for as long as I could actually withstand the physical pain, and then asked Sheena if we could sit the rest of the record out (after about 30 seconds!!).

Trampy