Tips sought - dancing in time

[thewacko]

Originally posted by Emma
Sweetheart, the bad boy rep has been down the pan ever since you stopped dismantling your trousers and wearing them on your head (Liz, I think you need to know what you're getting yourself into here! )

Hey they dont call me the wacko for nothing

so you finally got out of bed then em xxx

[firefly]

Apologies for resurrecting an old thread, but it relates to something I was thinking about after class last night, and wondered if anyone could give me some pointers?

I find when I'm dancing with some leads that we don't seem to be in time with the music, and that sets up a mismatch in my head as to whether I should be following exactly the way I'm led, or following the moves but more in time with the music? I only seem to have this problem with some leads; the complete beginners are usually trying to concentrate on so many other things as well that I just go with the flow, and with other leads I have such great dances that I find myself at the end thinking how short it was and wondering where the time went! I assume that means I didn't notice if we ever went off the beat

It tends to be something I notice with leaders who've been dancing for a while, and often have a good repertoire of moves which they can lead you into smoothly and confidently. And often it's not a huge mismatch, but enough for me to notice that we're dancing slightly out of time with the music. I do enjoy those dances, I'm just not sure what the correct thing would be for me to do in that situation.

I'm sorry if this is coming across as big-headed beginner syndrome. I know that there are things I could do to improve (arm tension, balance etc), and I'm not trying to suggest that my musicality is faultless. But I think I have a reasonably musical ear, so I get a bit frustrated knowing whether it would be better if I danced with my partner and ignored the music, or danced my partner's moves but to the music?

I think this post has turned out a bit longer than I expected! But I'd really appreciate some advice on what the right etiquette (correct dance term?) is. Any advice from both leaders AND followers would be much appreciated!

[Ghost]

Originally Posted by firefly

Any advice from both leaders AND followers would be much appreciated!

Personally. I think the lead has enough to worry about as it is. When I started Ceroc, I just learned to dance the beginners moves to the music (phrasing, vocals etc) and completely ignored the beat. Then when I'd got the hang of that, I learnt to do it with the beat. Then I learnt how to do it with the beat and the music.

Plus stuff happens - the lead's worrying about something, or their lover's getting a lttle too UCP with the person they're dancing with etc.

So I'd say, it's your role to follow. If the lead is completely off-beat and he seems to be dancing to something else entirely, well then it's a challenge to your following abilities.

You can try and feedback afterwards - they're different schools of though as to how good an idea this is though.

On the occassions when I follow. I'll play or interpret the music if given the chance, but I'll equally happily ignore the music and follow whatever's led.

Hope that helps,
Christopher

[Emma]

Dancing out of time can be grim, especially if it's a tune you like. My main trick for attempting to bring someone back on beat is to end a spin and offer my hand back on time, or less often to force a little pause (with wiggle, naturally) to come back into time.

Not everyone gets the hint, though; and ultimately the leader's leading so generally I'll just ignore the music if possible and follow. Like Ghost says there's a lot for leaders to think about, especially when they're new to dancing.

I've had some really lovely dances which completely ignored the music. I wouldn't have enjoyed them at all if I'd been listening to it

[Nick]

The best I can suggest is to try and find the guys who can dance in time.

Other than that...

If it's a track you don't know and can't anticipate, or a track that has a complicate rhythm, then don't sweat about it too much - that can be very hard to keep time to.

And...you will improve over time, as you relax into it, as you become familiar with the moves and with the ways of the various people you dance with.

Emma was right too. Ceroc's about having fun and enjoying the company - if you like the person you're dancing with that's important. Some of my favourite partners aren't the best dancers, but they're fun to dance with in some way or other.

[firefly]

Thanks to everyone who's posted. I think the advice really confirms what I'd suspected; the leader's leading and all I need to do is follow. Anything else is a bonus. Though I haven't been dancing ceroc that long, from the start I was pretty struck by how much the leader was expected to do - don't know how you guys (and gals!) do it!

I appreciate the advice to find partners who can dance in time, but I would like to improve, and I think one of the best ways of doing that is to dance as much as possible, with as many partners as possible.

At the end of the day my main aim is to have fun and enjoy myself; you can usually pick me out because of the huge cheesy grin I have on my face for most of the night!

(BTW Christopher, I like your taste in signatures. I see we share similar tastes! )

[Beowulf]

I have a novel approach to rhythm, that is, I don’t have any or at least I do but it’s usually the wrong one! I may be listening to, oh I don’t know, “The Mavericks” but in my head it ends up all Philip Glass!

I had a dance with, erm, Lorna is it? The Instructor at Culter, that was scary as obviously she was very in time with the beat and I, well, was dancing to my own internal soundtrack . The last thing I want to do when dancing is plant my 14st and Size 11 feet down on my dance partners delicate tootsies. No no.. that would never do.

I’m sure I’ll get there eventually but as you say it’s harder at the start for us blokes as we have to remember the moves, put them together in an interesting and non repetitive manner , follow the beat and look as if you’re enjoying yourself! (Which I do btw.. you just can’t tell as I’m too busy looking at my feet )

[straycat]

Originally Posted by Beowulf1970

I’m sure I’ll get there eventually but as you say it’s harder at the start for us blokes as we have to remember the moves, put them together in an interesting and non repetitive manner , follow the beat and look as if you’re enjoying yourself! (Which I do btw.. you just can’t tell as I’m too busy looking at my feet )

I'm sure this has been said before (I'm brand-new on this forum) - and I know it's easier said than done, but my own advice is to stop worrying about the moves, don't even worry about the beat - just focus on your partner and the music, relax, enjoy, and just dance. Everything else will follow. To me, musicality is king, and you can only really get that by dancing to the music.

A long long time ago, a certain famous teacher told me that she vastly preferred a beginner who knew barely two moves and enjoyed playing around to the music, to someone with a large repertoire, who was trying too hard...

I probably took that a little too seriously, as all this time later I still don't know many moves, but just make them up as I go - but that is half the fun of it.

[Gadget]

Originally Posted by straycat264

I'm sure this has been said before (I'm brand-new on this forum) - and I know it's easier said than done, but my own advice is to stop worrying about the moves, don't even worry about the beat - just focus on your partner and the music, relax, enjoy, and just dance. Everything else will follow. To me, musicality is king, and you can only really get that by dancing to the music.

Welcome
Unfortunatly I think some people get a bit freaked when you focus on them too much
The main "worry" with moves I think is that a lead dances the moves they know again and again with different people, with even more repetition when they only know one or two moves. It's not really that the follower's get board, but that the lead does: the follower changes to a different partner every dance - the lead is stuck with themselves all through the night!

I probably took that a little too seriously, as all this time later I still don't know many moves, but just make them up as I go - but that is half the fun of it.

So do I, but that requires confidence that you can get out of anything you get into, and that takes time and learning moves so you know some more options of how/where to get out of them.

I agree with what you are saying though: relax and just dance

[straycat]

Originally Posted by Gadget

Unfortunatly I think some people get a bit freaked when you focus on them too much

Well - I didn't mean 'stare at them like a lunatic and freak them out'. Although that can occasionally be funny. Ahem.
I really meant - don't ignore your partner - the follower, after all, is the focus of the dance, and the leader should be taking care of the follower at all times - we look better by showing off our followers, not by showing off ourselves. That's a little outside the remit of this thread though - not something for beginners to worry about.

Originally Posted by Gadget

The main "worry" with moves I think is that a lead dances the moves they know again and again with different people, with even more repetition when they only know one or two moves. It's not really that the follower's get board, but that the lead does: the follower changes to a different partner every dance - the lead is stuck with themselves all through the night!

Very true, which is why the following is so important...

Originally Posted by Gadget

I agree with what you are saying though: relax and just dance