Basic techniques

[Flash]

Originally Posted by Rachel

Some interesting bits, though. I would sooo love to print this out (from Robert) and display on huge posters around our venues:

'Be aware that there is a big jump between the Beginner and Intermediate classes so don't move up too early and be disappointed. Be totally confident that you are a competent and "safe" Beginner dancer before making the next step.

The Intermediate dancers in the class will expect you to be able to:
~ confidently lead or follow
~ have good balance in spins and firm tension
~ demonstrate good safe and secure technique in dips and drops
~ freestyle effortlessly and
~ be totally confident with counting the beat and keeping to the rhythm of the music.'

I'm a bit surprised they teach dips and drops in the beginners, though.

I did find when I was out there though that some of the moves they classify as beginner out there we actually teach as intermediate. Then when are 'allowed' to go on and join the intermediate class the basics, like tension have been taught so well that they run through 6-8 new intermediate moves in 30 mins and everyone seems to pick up the moves quite easily.

Another bit I found interesting - one of Robert's 3 golden rules for ladies' spins:

'You always spin on the foot you turn towards, ie spin to the Right on the Right foot and vice versa.'

I find this is usually the case with me, and the way we normally teach it, but it's the word 'always' that gets me.

I quite often push off my right foot to spin clockwise on my left - particularly for a Ceroc spin or other moves where spinning on my right will put me far too (dangerously) close to my partner. Wonder if I'm being technically incorrectly here???

Rachel

I also did an amazing spinning class and can now, with a stable lead spin 3-4 times effortlessly. It was the same in NZ. I can't wait to go back out there.

[Rachel]

Originally Posted by Flash

I also did an amazing spinning class and can now, with a stable lead spin 3-4 times effortlessly. It was the same in NZ. I can't wait to go back out there.

I'm jealous! Would love to go there so much!!

Any good tips from the spinning class that you can divulge?
Rachel

[Rachel]

Originally Posted by Flash

... the basics, like tension have been taught so well that they run through 6-8 new intermediate moves in 30 mins and everyone seems to pick up the moves quite easily....

Oh, you've got me thinking now - are their beginners' classes in the same format as ours? I mean, do they manage to get across good teaching on tension, etc, as well as covering 4 moves in 45 minutes? Where are we going wrong here?
Rache;

[spindr]

Robert's rules work for clockwise and anticlockwise rotations when the "non-axis" shoulder goes forwards -- they're basically the same as I posted in the Rules for stepping back thread Rules for stepping back -- but I've had a few thoughts since then...

Ok, there's two directions for rotations: clockwise and anticlockwise, but there's four different ways you can do a rotation:

• axis, i.e. weight on left: bring right non-axis shoulder forwards == anticlockwise
• axis, i.e. weight on left: bring right non-axis shoulder backwards == clockwise
• axis, i.e. weight on right: bring left non-axis shoulder forwards == clockwise
• axis, i.e. weight on right: bring left non-axis shoulder backwards == anticlockwise

You can do rotations where the "non-axis" shoulder goes backwards but then the footwork won't be the same as Robert's rules (the legs will be the opposite way round ). It seems odd, but it's quite a common motion for the ladies, as that's how they'll do the twist out in a first move -- the lady will turn clockwise, but her weight will be on her left leg (because the right shoulder goes backwards), with the right foot free which is taken backwards. You can do spins like this,which might save you a weight transfer -- but probably not a great idea for beginners.

SpinDr.

[Martin]

Originally Posted by Rachel

I would sooo love to print this out (from Robert) and display on huge posters around our venues:

'Be aware that there is a big jump between the Beginner and Intermediate classes so don't move up too early and be disappointed. Be totally confident that you are a competent and "safe" Beginner dancer before making the next step.

The Intermediate dancers in the class will expect you to be able to:
~ confidently lead or follow
~ have good balance in spins and firm tension
~ demonstrate good safe and secure technique in dips and drops
~ freestyle effortlessly and
~ be totally confident with counting the beat and keeping to the rhythm of the music.'

I'm a bit surprised they teach dips and drops in the beginners, though.

Another bit I found interesting - one of Robert's 3 golden rules for ladies' spins:

'You always spin on the foot you turn towards, ie spin to the Right on the Right foot and vice versa.'

I find this is usually the case with me, and the way we normally teach it, but it's the word 'always' that gets me.

I quite often push off my right foot to spin clockwise on my left - particularly for a Ceroc spin or other moves where spinning on my right will put me far too (dangerously) close to my partner. Wonder if I'm being technically incorrectly here???

Rachel

Good tips from Robert on the beginners front, the beginner and intermediate classes are of a harder/higher level generally in aussie.

I don't think they do a lot of dips drops in beginners apart from the 1st move safe dip (over both thighs), they do encorage the intro intermediate workshop and have intro intermediate classes though to cover what is needed.

With spinning I always tell the ladies "as a rule whichever shoulder you turn towards, that is the foot you spin on and step back on"
Rules are there to be broken, but are good as initial learning aids for beginners.

[Rachel]

Originally Posted by Martin

... they do encorage the intro intermediate workshop and have intro intermediate classes though to cover what is needed.

Ah, now that makes a lot of sense ...

Originally Posted by Martin

... Rules are there to be broken, but are good as initial learning aids for beginners.

Martin, you just made me feel a whole lot better!

Nice to talk to you again! Any plans for your next trip over? And did your Ossie friends ever decide which competition they'd like to tie up with their trip? BTW please pass on congratulations to Janet for the JiveMasters.

I'd better stop now as this is getting to be more like a personal letter ...
Rachel

[Flash]

Originally Posted by Rachel

I'm jealous! Would love to go there so much!!

Any good tips from the spinning class that you can divulge?
Rachel

Hi Rachel,

They lined us all up looking straight ahead at a mirrored wall. The basics of it were step forward on right, left, right and spin. Left, right, left and spin.
Arms
Obviously arms in - go faster, out slows you down. And, up and straight out at shoulder level going to in either arms straight down or bent and pulled in speeds up the spin.

Spotting
I can't emphasise this enough. Whether it's a spot on the wall in practice or partners eyes while dancing. It's a must to regain alignment in between multiple spins.

Other points
Step into, and rise up into each spin.
On ball of foot.
Knee almost ever so slightly bent. This straightens the spine - apparently!!

Hope this helps?!

[Rachel]

Originally Posted by Flash

....Knee almost ever so slightly bent. This straightens the spine - apparently!!

Hope this helps?!

Thank you - great tips!!! I found the above bit particularly interesting - I didn't know that! ... Actually, I just had to stand up and try it, and it does make sense - it kind of brings your pelvis more underneath you. Excellent!
Rachel

[Flash]

Originally Posted by Rachel

Oh, you've got me thinking now - are their beginners' classes in the same format as ours? I mean, do they manage to get across good teaching on tension, etc, as well as covering 4 moves in 45 minutes? Where are we going wrong here?
Rache;

Please note this is all only in my opinion

A few differences between OZ/NZ and here (danced in many London venues and now Scotland)
Right from the start the attention to detail. Every class I attended started with taking partners hands and getting the tension by pushing against each other.
Next was the 'ceroc step' step back (L or R leg) step back. Step forward step forward. Opposite leg to your partner.
This is done to music.
Then 'warm up' would be getting this step going and doing some very simple beginner moves for 1/3 of a track. Move partner. This goes on for 2-3 tracks. I found then I was warm, dancing and ready to go.

Also dancing in a huge circle with the teachers in the middle meant everybody could see. This is clearly venue dependant.

Teachers would also jump off the stage or out of the circle and go and dance with the cerocers. Paying particular attention to those 'new' faces and continue the class from there, once at the stage wherby most people had a very good idea of the move. Then returning to the stage before the next move begins to be taught.

The only other major thing I noticed was the basics are taught in details from the start. Men not using thumbs, a good hand hold, posture, and for the men a lot of emphasis on how to return the women.

Like I said I can't wait to go back.....

[Andy McGregor]

Originally Posted by Rachel

I quite often push off my right foot to spin clockwise on my left - particularly for a Ceroc spin or other moves where spinning on my right will put me far too (dangerously) close to my partner. Wonder if I'm being technically incorrectly here???

Rachel

At MJ classes I've always been taught to spin on the foot in the direction I'm going. But a few weeks ago Nigel mentioned that Ballet dancers spin on the other foot as well. So I've been trying this from time to time. You do initially feel like you're going backwards and I've found it difficult because it's new. Something I have found out though, is that you can finish the spin off with a dramatic rondo sort of flourish with your unweighted foot. At the moment I can only do single spins this way but I'm practicing, practicing, practicing, etc.

[Rachel]

Originally Posted by Andy McGregor

... Ballet dancers spin on the other foot as well. ...

Ah ha ... maybe I'll blame it on that then!

[Zebra Woman]

Originally Posted by Flash

Teachers would also jump off the stage or out of the circle and go and dance with the cerocers. Paying particular attention to those 'new' faces and continue the class from there, once at the stage wherby most people had a very good idea of the move. Then returning to the stage before the next move begins to be taught.
....

This is how I was taught (Le Roc). I got to feel how the move should be and sometimes got a personal tip from the teacher or the demo. Real luxury. I know it's not possible with 150 in the room, but I guess that's how our 'Cerocshops' work.

Our next best thing....I like to see the teacher/demo dancing with (and passing on tips to) the newbies, it helps to make people feel included. Of course the rest of have to join in too...

[Flash]

My first ever class was somewhere near Milton Keynes. Bletchley?

[Martin]

Originally Posted by Andy McGregor

At MJ classes I've always been taught to spin on the foot in the direction I'm going. But a few weeks ago Nigel mentioned that Ballet dancers spin on the other foot as well. So I've been trying this from time to time. You do initially feel like you're going backwards and I've found it difficult because it's new. Something I have found out though, is that you can finish the spin off with a dramatic rondo sort of flourish with your unweighted foot. At the moment I can only do single spins this way but I'm practicing, practicing, practicing, etc.

And I do know you practice hard.

Having taught body rolls with both people "rolling" at Rock bottoms, I must say I was wondering whether I had gone "too advanced" when looking at the class.

I was so encoraged to see you at Hipsters a bit later much improved and doing fabby body rolls.

Made me feel I had achieved my goal as a teacher.

Just observing that encoraged me to keep teaching the harder moves that I love, breaking them down as best I know, for people to go away and practice.

[Martin]

Originally Posted by Rachel

Ah, now that makes a lot of sense ...

Martin, you just made me feel a whole lot better!

Nice to talk to you again! Any plans for your next trip over? And did your Ossie friends ever decide which competition they'd like to tie up with their trip? BTW please pass on congratulations to Janet for the JiveMasters.

I'd better stop now as this is getting to be more like a personal letter ...
Rachel

Next trip - unknown as yet.
Janet did say the other day - I want to go back to the UK !

Aussie friends making Jive Masters AND next year Blackpool - watch out UK.
As they are also fabby teachers we are working out a deal where they teach as well and cover the trip (limited cash). We are in negotiations with UK venues at the moment. (I am trying to put the pieces together).

Janet was "so cool" with Gary at the Jive Masters Aussie, all credit to her, she has only been dancing for 18 months and took on the best, got to the finals.

[Gary]

Originally Posted by Martin

Aussie friends making Jive Masters AND next year Blackpool - watch out UK.

Guys, if you get the chance to dance with Louise, take it! She is a goddess.

Also grab the chance to get to any workshops Adrian and Louise run -- they're great teachers.

[Lory]

Originally Posted by Andy McGregor

a few weeks ago Nigel mentioned that Ballet dancers spin on the other foot as well.

They do!

They are called different things a Pirouette 'en dehors' - meaning moving outwards, would be standing on the left leg but turning clockwise

And a Pirouette En dedans meaning - inwards, is standing on left leg turning anti clockwise!

I'd just like to add, I know what they are and I know what they look like but that doesn't mean to say I can do them!

[Rachel]

Originally Posted by Lory

They do!

They are called different things a Pirouette 'en dehors' - meaning moving outwards, would be standing on the left leg but turning clockwise

And a Pirouette En dedans meaning - inwards, is standing on left leg turning anti clockwise!

Or even ... dehors: on the right leg turning anti-clockwise, and dedans: right leg/clockwise.
R x

[Rachel]

Originally Posted by Lory

...I'd just like to add, I know what they are and I know what they look like but that doesn't mean to say I can do them!

Can't give you another rep yet, but just wanted to say that you looked great dancing at Hipsters the other night - pirouettes or not!!
Rachel

[Rachel]

Originally Posted by Flash

My first ever class was somewhere near Milton Keynes. Bletchley?

Bletchley - yep! That's Marc's venue - or, rather, regular teaching place.
Rachel