Exciting new beginner moves!

[MartinHarper]

Ceroc Wythal taught us intermediates a funky new "beginner" move - the "slow back pass", which apparently is replacing the normal "back pass". It's different, and one I'll enjoy using in freestyle, I reckon. Apparently a Ceroc-wide thing. Anyone know any other moves that have been added or dropped recently?

[DavidY]

I've heard that the back-pass was being replaced, and little-em taught a potential replacement a few weeks back. How does this one go?

Personally I liked the back-pass as a beginners' move because it's a really simple one and easy to lead with the newest beginner, although it's not the most exciting move for intermediates.

The proposed replacement I saw relied on the leader stopping the follower from walking round, and also having weight on the correct feet in order to step from side to side. I found this hard to lead with people who hadn't seen the move before (maybe it's just me though ).

[MartinHarper]

It starts off like a "man spin", but with a R-R hold. Then, instead of catching the girl hand to hand as you face each other, you pretend to be some sort of wrestler and wrap your arm round the side of her arm and lock into her forearm/elbow. Wiggle, wiggle, wiggle, release, and step back.

I also like the back pass, so I won't stop doing that.

[Gadget]

[Lory]

I know I've got a stupid sense of humor but what sort of name is 'a slow back pass'?

I mean, why didn't they just go the whole hog and call it the 'slow sneaky back pass' or the 'silent but deadly back pass?

[MartinHarper]

Another new one: the "step across". Like man's spin, or shoulder slide, but raise the L-R arms into an arch and step underneath it.

One thing I noted: Ceroc style is to raise the handhold and step forward under it at normal height. JazzJive style is to keep the handhold closer to normal height and bend at the knees to slide under it. Regardless, what's wrong is bending at the waist to get under - which I end up doing if I don't think about it. Tut.

[spindr]

Originally Posted by MartinHarper

Regardless, what's wrong is bending at the waist to get under - which I end up doing if I don't think about it. Tut.

Hey, I just keep the hands at shoulder height, lean back and limbo

You can drop onto one knee instead.

My other current version is to bend double (touch the floor) and the lady's hand will end in the small of your back -- although there sometimes seems to be a degree of "inappropriate touching" if you do this version.

SpinDr.

[Stuart M]

Originally Posted by MartinHarper

Another new one: the "step across". Like man's spin, or shoulder slide, but raise the L-R arms into an arch and step underneath it.

The step across has been taught in beginner's classes for as long as I can remember around here. Which is about 5 years. Excuse me, must go lie down - that last sentence made me feel old...

[Gadget]

Originally Posted by MartinHarper

Another new one: the "step across". Like man's spin, or shoulder slide, but raise the L-R arms into an arch and step underneath it.

that's not a new one - It's a very old one; "step across" is high hand, "shoulder slide" is at shoulder level, and "man spin" is at waist height - the three main levels that the hand should be (and the first "combo" I ever delibretly put together)

In the step across, I use my right hand, flat, thumb to floor to guide the lady's nearest hip (right) past me. It also means I can prevent her from tring to turn under a hand that's above me rather than her, and gives her warning of the move. (in addition to providing me with something to do with my off hand )
It's an addition to what's taught from stage, but I find it helps lead the move and provides me with added options of where I could go next.

...what's wrong is bending at the waist to get under - which I end up doing if I don't think about it. Tut.

Because it looks un-intentional; a reaction to avoid hitting yourself in the face rather than an action of stapping. Same with any ducking move that you bend at the waist for - so much more stylish if you drop to one knee or similar while keeping yor body upright.


The new beginner move I'm still unsure of using with beginners is the shoulder drop - it is one of the hardest to lead properly (including most intermediate moves) and actually requires the lady to follow properly: the move is done behind you with one hand - you can't give any additional hints or use the other hand.

[stewart38]

Originally Posted by Stuart M

The step across has been taught in beginner's classes for as long as I can remember around here. Which is about 5 years. Excuse me, must go lie down - that last sentence made me feel old...

Its was being taught 10yrs ago any advance

[Simon r]

Originally Posted by stewart38

Its was being taught 10yrs ago any advance

Actually it is a variation of the old step across and the new described step across holds for an extra 4 beats before the finish.
i think you will find the original was being taught in ther 40,s so that might just be past both of your memories...

[Jive Brummie]

Originally Posted by Simon r

Actually it is a variation of the old step across and the new described step across holds for an extra 4 beats before the finish.
i think you will find the original was being taught in ther 40,s so that might just be past both of your memories...

[DavidY]

Originally Posted by Gadget

The new beginner move I'm still unsure of using with beginners is the shoulder drop - it is one of the hardest to lead properly (including most intermediate moves) and actually requires the lady to follow properly: the move is done behind you with one hand - you can't give any additional hints or use the other hand.

I find the tricky bit in leading the shoulder drop is making sure you end up close enough to your partner after you've both turned. The leading-behind-your-back thing usually works OK for me - I lead the variant where you step to the side (opposite ways) and catch at your left hand side to return the follower in front.

I do like the Shoulder Drop as a beginners' move because you can use it to hit a musical break. If you time it so that after the leader turns and latches the follower's hand on the shoulder, you stop in time with the break, it can be quite effective.

This means you can introduce beginners to musicality with a move they learnt in the beginners' class, and it's a safe stop (you're both standing upright, not in a lean or seducer or whatever).

[MartinHarper]

Perhaps I should clarify - I meant the step across was new as in it was new as a move in the beginner's routines, rather than being new in an absolute sense.

[Whitebeard]

Originally Posted by MartinHarper

Perhaps I should clarify - I meant the step across was new as in it was new as a move in the beginner's routines, rather than being new in an absolute sense.

What's possibly happened is that although it doesn't appear on the list of beginner's moves, as posted on the Worcester Ceroc site**, it may well have been reinstated as such more recently.

Certainly I learned it as a beginner move last year and like Gadget my first combination of moves was the step across, shoulder slide, and man turn. And as a result I'd developed travelling returns before I'd actually been taught this variation. Quite exhillerating to faster music.

** Why isn't this information on the parent site ??

[Gadget]

Originally Posted by DavidY

I find the tricky bit in leading the shoulder drop is making sure you end up close enough to your partner after you've both turned.

You probably start turning too soon.

The leading-behind-your-back thing usually works OK for me - I lead the variant where you step to the side (opposite ways) and catch at your left hand side to return the follower in front.

I have found that leaning (or stepping/lunging) in the opposite direction from your out-streached arm, (so that the motion is half and half) allows a full straight arm without the lady having to move for miles {I've got long arms }
The 'normal' variation goes from here back to the "hand on shoulder" position, then step forward to back-catch in a 'one-handed-almost-cattapult' lean, then pull down and through as you step back to make the lady travel forward on her return, gentle push and step back in-line. 7 counts {I think?}.
If you replace the 'back-catch and lean' with a 'side catch and traveling turn' you are forcing the lady to travel in a (fairly large) diagonal while turning; most other moves that travel while turning are on the x or y axis, encouraging a more controlled movement and easier directional sense for the lady.
Instead of ending with a traveling return, why not turn 90º to face and step in to a first move ballroom hold?

I do like the Shoulder Drop as a beginners' move because you can use it to hit a musical break.~snip~This means you can introduce beginners to musicality with a move they learnt in the beginners' class, and it's a safe stop (you're both standing upright, not in a lean or seducer or whatever)

You can use any move to hit a musical break: simplest it to just 'freeze' on a count, then keep the lady in that position while you move/turn to face untill the song resumes. No leans, seducers, dips or poses required (well, perhaps some posing ) and it is just as/even more effective than the other stuff that relys on having an intermediate dancer at the end of your arm.

[stewart38]

Originally Posted by MartinHarper

Perhaps I should clarify - I meant the step across was new as in it was new as a move in the beginner's routines, rather than being new in an absolute sense.

The step across as is now wants taught as is then as a beginners move in guildford 10yrs ago same number of beats

I thank you

[tsh]

Now that I've seen the new slow back-pass in a class, I can say that I won't be bothering to learn it. It never worked for me in the class, so I can't see it working in freestyle.

The problem seemed to be that it was never really very clear when the step across part stopped and the 'stand there looking bored' bit starts/ends.

Sean

[Jayne]

Originally Posted by stewart38

The step across as is now wants taught as is then as a beginners move in guildford 10yrs ago same number of beats

I thank you

Does this make sense to anyone?

J