Murder (Smoking) on the Dancefloor

[Sal]

Cigarette smoke irritates my lenses, so would love venues to be smoke-free. I could stop looking like a red-eyed monster!

[Fran]

Originally posted by Franck
Personally hate it too! .
We have not banned smoking in any venues in Scotland (at the moment), but in fairness, we don't get that many smokers, certainly fewer than I have noticed in London, and most of them seem to (politely) go outside...

Franck.

I think you are right Franck, most smokers thankfully do go out side. I hate the smell of smoke and one of the things I like about dancing is that unlike going into clubs/pubs we dont end up recking of it when we come out.

I have only once walked into the ladies at Marcos and discovered that someone had been smoking - all of us who where in there could smell the smoke on our hair - Uck!:reallymad
I cant remember where I was ( yes I was sober) but quite recently I was at a venue and a man was smoking a really smelly cigar totally unaware that it was unpleasant for all the people around him. Thankfully it does not happen very often.

Fran

[Alfie]

Hi all
Concerning smoking at venues. There are some venues in the Midlands where smoking is discouraged and others where there are ash trays placed on the tables and nobody complains if you have a ciggarette.
I have been a smoker for many years and I enjoy the odd ciggie betwwen bops, however I will bow to the wishes of the majority and go outside to have a smoke if that is what is asked of me.
I did a Victor and Lydia Workshop at Nantwich a couple of years ago and out of the fifty or so people taking part I was the only smoker (I crept away to a quiet corner) which left me feeling like a bit of a lepper.
There are not that many people who smoke at ceroc in the Midlands but I don't see the harm in smoking/non smoking areas inside venues away from the dance floor. It can be a bit of a downer having to stand outside in the cold and wet just to have a quick fag.
Personally I dont think it will be too many years before smoking is banned in all public places, as is being intoduced in Norway at the moment.

[Wendy]

Smoking kills. Passive smoking kills. (And hands up anyone who disagrees - go on I dare you !!!!!!).

I am so glad someone has brought this up as I've been meaning to for ages.

It only takes one smoker to make the place smoky and sadly this encourages other smokers to think it's OK and then they light up and so on. CEROC should take a stance on this one. You can't smoke at work and you can't smoke at an aerobics class so I cannot understand why it is permitted at CEROC.

One of the reasons I didn't stick with salsa was because of the smoky conditions - usually in bars with people free to ogle with a fag in their mouth !!! No thank you !!!

Take it outside - kill yourself if you want just don't kill the rest of us !!!!


Wx
(ex-smoker - you'll not be surprised to hear !!!)

[TheTramp]

It only takes one smoker to make the place smoky and sadly this encourages other smokers to think it's OK and then they light up and so on. CEROC should take a stance on this one. You can't smoke at work and you can't smoke at an aerobics class so I cannot understand why it is permitted at CEROC.

I think that this sums up my thoughts quite nicely.

Steve
(never, ever, smoked. never ever will)

[Heather]

But my ex-husband is a smoker. My house is a smoke free zone these days , as is my workplace and most other places I frequent. This makes me all the more aware of people smoking, when I do encounter it.I really hate when my daughter, comes home from a weekend at her dad's with her hair and clothes smelling of smoke. And yes, Wendy, passive smoking kills, you'd think he'd have more consideration for his child, but the truth is he, like most smokers are selfish and think only of their own needs and not of others.
Fran, I don't suppose you noticed the two ladies smoking at Marc's last night ? Unfortunately, they sat at my table, and although I avoided sitting there as much as possible (too busy dancing or trying to pry your partner and mine apart!! ) , My hair and clothes still stink of smoke.
Why put ashtrays on the table at all? It only makes smokers think that it is acceptable. If they didn't put them out, then the smokers would have to go out for a puff.

Heather,

[Heather]

SORRY, I do, of course mean Marco's!!!!!!

Heather,

Really must use the Preview button!!!!

[Jayne]

I too am a passionate anti-smoker - as a child I saw my gandmother's ceiling one month after it was decorated and it's put me off for life! Thankfully most people at ceroc do take it outside (one exception being the woman at our table last night at Marco's :reallymad ), which is great. Personally I'd love all ceroc venues to be non-smoking - I guess we'll just have to see where public opinion gets us!

Jayne

[Gadget]

While this is a 'public' forum for Ceroc people, I don't think that that it reflects a true section of cerocers; only the section that have internet access and an interest in posting on the forum.
This pole only shows that of this section of dancers, there is an overwhelming view to ban smoking from the venues - it isn't necessarily a true reflection.
However, if there were some sort of ballot at the venues, then a better selection of people could be asked and a more realistic figure given.
Is it worth the time/expense to do this? Are the organizers of venues prepared to take action on the result of a pole? Is it safe to assume that this selection does reflect a true cross-section of the ceroc public?

[Dave Hancock]

Gadget
Is there some sort of correlation between internet users and non-smokers???

Although I do agree that purely on the basis of this poll that smoking can't be banned, as 30 odd votes out of 500 - a thousand regular dancers within Scotland is far too small a sample to act on.

However I think that it would be very easy to organise a ballot and ask everyone coming in at night to tick an anonymous form with only a couple of optons shown ( you could even cut it down to a staight should somking be banned at Ceroc Scotland - Yes or no).

So what does Franck think, I am taxi dancing a week on Tuesday and would certainly be more then happy to organise an Aberdeen ballot.

[Franck]

Originally posted by Dave Hancock
So what does Franck think, I am taxi dancing a week on Tuesday and would certainly be more then happy to organise an Aberdeen ballot.

I don't think that there is a need for a ballot at all.
As shown here , the clear view is that venues should be non-smoking.

Smoking at Ceroc venues is offensive to all dancers, but, and this is an important point, banning smoking outright would go against the relaxed / club atmosphere we are trying to promote to attract new members.
People already feel nervous when they join a Ceroc class, and are pleasantly surprised to find out that it is very similar to a 'normal' night out. They can have a drink, a smoke, sit and chat to friends, and on top of that, they learn a really easy to pick up dance!
This is important to the (outside) perception of what a Ceroc night is. However, once they have got the Ceroc bug, even heavy smokers, realise that smoking near the dance floor is bad news and generally will stop.

I am still looking into it though, and getting keener on the idea of an outright ban regardless. I will talk to the Venue managers in the next couple of weeks, as they are at the frontline and, no doubt would have to enforce such a ban (as well as stopping aerial merchants).

Franck.

[TheTramp]

While this is a 'public' forum for Ceroc people, I don't think that that it reflects a true section of cerocers; only the section that have internet access and an interest in posting on the forum.
This pole only shows that of this section of dancers, there is an overwhelming view to ban smoking from the venues - it isn't necessarily a true reflection.

I agree that it isn't necessarily a true reflection. But not for the reasons that you put forward, Gadget.

The reasons that it's not a true reflection are these. Firstly, most of the people who post on the forum are at least intermediate dancers, but generally are among the better dancers. These people are less likely to tolerate smokers, because they want to spend their entire evening dancing, rather than people who haven't been dancing so long, so are more likely to sit on the side and have a drink and smoke while watching.

Secondly, with the direction the poll was going, people who would like to have a smoke might be intimidated into not actually saying so, because of being in a very small minority. If I logged onto a poll, and saw that 33 (out of 34) people had voted against my opinion, I might well not bother to actually vote.

Other than that, the sample space of the total population (ie. those who post on the forum, see the post, and can be bothered to vote) would be as reasonable as any other method of choosing a sample (other than obviously asking everyone who is at the venue - but then, how do you account for the people who are not there that evening?).

Steve

[PeterL]

People already feel nervous when they join a Ceroc class, and are pleasantly surprised to find out that it is very similar to a 'normal' night out. They can have a drink, a smoke, sit and chat to friends, and on top of that, they learn a really easy to pick up dance!

The above is true. I remember my first night at ceroc. Looking at everyone dancing was very intimidating. However it was the friendliness of the people there that reduced the intimidation and made me go back.
I started at st Stephens where you do have to go outside for a ciggarette and didn't think twice about this. Most smokers are used to having to go outside to smoke, and when there is a blanket ban on smoking anyone that does smoke is not the sort of person you want there.
There must be obvious exceptions such as the case when the venus is a public bar (O Donaghues for example) but in these places simply enforce a ban around the actual dancefloor.

It is worth considering that many smokers going to ceroc especially in the new year are actually trying to quit and going to a friendly venue where they have something to do without the distraction of people smoking is an encouragement to attend rather than a discouragement.

[Franck]

Hi guys,

After extensive consultation (forum poll and chats with venue managers etc...), we have decided that from January 2003, all Ceroc venues in Scotland would become "Smoke free zones". Think of it as a "New Year's resolution"...

We will be printing "No smoking" signs and venue managers / teachers and Taxi-dancers will monitor the situation!

So here you go guys, another achievement, and concrete change originated from this Forum!

Franck.

[TheTramp]

YAY FRANCK!!!!

I'm so glad I started this poll now. Other franchise holders take note!

Now, if you can just find a way to may Scotland closer to London please.....

Steve

[CJ]

Originally posted by TheTramp
YAY FRANCK!!!!

Now, if you can just find a way to may Scotland closer to London please.....

You know, if the WHOLE world didn't revolve around London, it would be SO much easier to accomplish!!

[TheTramp]

It doesn't. I've been trying to get out of it for the last 6 months.

The other option is to move London nearer to Scotland. Either works fine with me!!

Steve

[John S]

Originally posted by Franck
Hi guys,

After extensive consultation (forum poll and chats with venue managers etc...), we have decided that from January 2003, all Ceroc venues in Scotland would become "Smoke free zones". Think of it as a "New Year's resolution"...

We will be printing "No smoking" signs and venue managers / teachers and Taxi-dancers will monitor the situation!

Personally I am delighted, but there may be people who have been regular stalwarts at Ceroc classes for years who will be upset by this, so I hope for their sake it is introduced sensitively, rather than as a police action.

After all, for them it is a change of the rules they have known for however long they've been coming. Also, the comment has been made to me that smokers are often unhappy about their smoking anyway, and if they have to do without Ceroc too then they'll be even more unhappy.

On the other hand, it might save their lives if they choose to give up smoking (as well as helping the rest of us who are at risk through passive smoking)!

So I think it's the correct decision, but it should be introduced with prior notice and with sensitivity.

[Ronde!]

Hi all,

interestingly, our region (Australian Capital Territory in Australia) went through this debate about 10 years ago. The result? Smoking is now banned in all public venues and most workplaces except those that have constructed specially ventilated smoking areas and applied for government exemption.

For the last 5 years or so (the policy was introduced in three phases), you can go out almost anywhere and not come home smelling of smoke. Not that Canberra is the nightlife capital of the world or anything.

Might seem extreme; but employers (including venue owners) can be sued if people develop problems from passive smoking; and everyone's quite used to it now.

[Mike Allsopp]

Hi folks,

I appreciate that a lot of chat has gone on around this smoking or non-smoking issue, but I cannot understand why you are looking to Ceroc to issue a ban at venues..... it is unnecessary, do it yourself!

As a franchisee, if I decide I do not want smoking at my venues then that is it, I do not have to push HQ for support on the matter, I hire the hall, I run the night and it is my choice. It is very much the same as should I not want a particular individual to attend my night then that is it, they don't come in, no arguements, no consultation with HQ.

Conversely, however, if HQ issued a smoking ban it would not be enforcible by them, they could suggest, even recommend, but at the end of the day it is down to the franchisee.

I think individual franchisees should look at the depth of feeling at thier own venues and decide themselves.... if they allow smoking near the dance area they might find visitors will not visit again if they are used to cleaner air elsewhere.

Me, personally, I have never smoked, would rather eat my own earwax than put a lighted cigarette near my mouth but can see that persuading members to nip outdoors for thier 'fix' is the most agreeable suggestion so far...... a lot of Ceroc people do smoke but are polite enough not to indulge others involuntarily.

I think that smokers nowadays are pretty used to restrictions and accept them without too much problem.

Happy New Year all

Mike