Yellow and Red Cards?

[John S]

There have been several threads on the forum which have started out reasonably, and contained worthwhile, well thought-out comments and information which will have benefited all readers.

Then, for what seem usually to be personal (or personality) reasons (as opposed to rational arguments about the merits or otherwise of the subject under discussion), what started as sweetness and light descends into personal abuse, resulting in the whole thread being "taken outside" and eventually binned - including all the beneficial or innocent contributions.

I have no quarrel at all with the moderators' judgment in doing this, they are perfectly correct to dissociate Ceroc Scotland from the personal bile that is in some of these threads, and it is too much work to delete only the offensive stuff.

But those who cause a thread to be moved outside by their offensive contributions are in effect denying the rest of us on the forum the right to refer back at some future date to the worthwhile contributions in the thread - it will all have been binned - as well of course as creating headaches for the moderators and making us all feel uncomfortable in reading their comments.

My suggestion, and it may well have been considered before and rejected, is that we should all be subject to a system similar to that in football, ie:
1st offence: yellow card (warning)
2nd offence: red card (dismissal from the forum - temporary or permanent)

I have no wish to stifle robust argument or discussion, but unacceptable personal abuse reduces the value of the forum - I know I have been very reluctant to take part in any thread where I see that members with "previous" are already participating.

[David Bailey]

Actually, that's pretty much how the current infraction system operates now.

There's a set of points, and a threshold above which members' behaviour gets restricted or ultimately banned - either temporarily or permanently. Bit like accumulating points on a driving license.

I think the only difference between that and your system is that these infractions aren't publicized - are you suggesting that they should be?

The other "control" system, of course is peer judgement through negative repping - although repping is not enabled for Outside posts.

Generally, I think the system works OK - yes, there's been a lot of aggro this week, but it's swings and roundabouts - sometimes whole months go by without people getting annoyed at each other.

[StokeBloke]

Such a good idea that the forum already has a system for dealing with this. You are issued with infraction points leading to temporary or permanent bans.

[John S]

OK, if the moderators are happy that the present system is working then I won't pursue this any further.

As to whether those already on a warning should be publicly shown (eg with a yellow card against them) I'm not sure - we are all capable of saying/writing things we regret and there's probably no need to draw the world's attention to it - provided there is no further cause for the ultimate sanction of being de-forumated (that must be a word, surely!)

[Double Trouble]

Originally Posted by John S

de-forumated

If only there was a weapon called a De-forumator. I'd LOVE one of those.

[CJ]

U'd only shoot urself in the foot

[Double Trouble]

Originally Posted by CJ

U'd only shoot urself in the foot

Either you're suggesting I'm a bad shot or I'd be the first one to be de-forumated.

I've got news for you CJ....It's BOTH, so stick that in you're sporran and poke it.

[David Bailey]

Originally Posted by John S

OK, if the moderators are happy that the present system is working then I won't pursue this any further.

Happy? Mmm... dunno.

But the more vigorously we apply the rules, the more we get accused of being power-crazed dictators or whatever. So there's a balance to be drawn, and a lot of judgement / discretionary decisions to be made.

For example, taking a thread Outside sometimes invigorates it - which is not what we're trying to do. But sometimes it's best to do this instead of telling people "Calm down" all the time, or pruning individual posts.

Similarly, personal abuse is against the rules. But we don't infract everyone who - for example - calls someone a donkey. Context matters.

The best way to complain about any post is to report it. That allows us to record, discuss and monitor actions as a group, and that ensures the system works best in my opinion.

[Ghost]

Originally Posted by John S

There have been several threads on the forum which have started out reasonably, and contained worthwhile, well thought-out comments and information which will have benefited all readers.

I know threads have been cut so that the reasonable beginning was left inside, or a reasonable point was brought back inside (eg what is reality). I've actually got a thread or two moved completely back inside by focusing entirely on the actual points.

Originally Posted by John S

I have no wish to stifle robust argument or discussion, but unacceptable personal abuse reduces the value of the forum - I know I have been very reluctant to take part in any thread where I see that members with "previous" are already participating.

It has gotten to the point where I now wait to see how long it takes for Religious threads to get taken outside. I've now pretty much given up trying to discuss such things here and mainly just add the odd correction / clarification.

[martingold]

Originally Posted by DavidJames

Happy? Mmm... dunno.

But the more vigorously we apply the rules, the more we get accused of being power-crazed dictators or whatever.

You mean the moderators are not power- crazed dictators??? (recon you need some other moderators then) hehehehe

[Isis]

Originally Posted by Ghost

It has gotten to the point where I now wait to see how long it takes for Religious threads to get taken outside. I've now pretty much given up trying to discuss such things here and mainly just add the odd correction / clarification.

That's a real shame