Connection is...

[Tiggerbabe]

Originally Posted by MartinHarper

Ghost did specifically say "at the women's requests", so I don't think these possibilities apply.

Yes, but he said that it helps the feeling of connection, and I (along with Caro) am curious as to how it possibly could, and why they would want him to tell them what he was about to lead.

[Caro]

Originally Posted by Lynn

Though the context in which I think of whispering leads is often the one with most intense connection - such as close embrace tango. There is such a level of connection that only the smallest of whispers, a tiny movement from the lead, is enough to communicate.

Indeed. If you are sufficiently connected in an AT context you can even respond to the intention - i.e. just before the actual leads happen. Had a fantastic and quite mind blowing experience of that just yesterday (will post more in the learning tango thread).
I guess with practice and technique you should also be able to respond to whispering intentions... and we'd be getting close to mind-reading there!

[Lynn]

Originally Posted by Tiggerbabe

Yes, but he said that it helps the feeling of connection, and I (along with Caro) am curious as to how it possibly could,

(And me!)

[Lynn]

Originally Posted by Caro

Indeed. If you are sufficiently connected in an AT context you can even respond to the intention - i.e. just before the actual leads happen. Had a fantastic and quite mind blowing experience of that just yesterday (will post more in the learning tango thread).
I guess with practice and technique you should also be able to respond to whispering intentions... and we'd be getting close to mind-reading there!

Yep. Lovely. I think you can get the same effect in 'micro blues' as well.

[Ghost]

Originally Posted by FirstMove

So, to summarise this thread so far....

Connection is dancing like Franck, or Dave B. No-one else knows what it is, or if they do then they're not telling.

Ok this is where I was coming from. If you have no connection in the first place, how do you get some? For me the feeling of talking works as a starting place (as opposed to actual talking). For the deeper stuff I'd have to start writing about sunsets

Originally Posted by Tiggerbabe

It does? How exactly? When I have danced with someone who tells me what move they are away to do, I don't think it's ever made me feel more connected with them

Originally Posted by MartinHarper

Ghost did specifically say "at the women's requests", so I don't think these possibilities apply.

Originally Posted by Tiggerbabe

Yes, but he said that it helps the feeling of connection, and I (along with Caro) am curious as to how it possibly could, and why they would want him to tell them what he was about to lead.

In all the cases they were new and learning. And it was specific to them. I'm not enamoured of the idea of women learning to recognise moves, but if that's what they want to do . One lady was so overwhelmed by the whole thing she just wanted me to say "Step left. Step back etc". It helped her relax and stop worrying. You know when your following isn't working and you get stressed and in doing so become more disconnected and then your following is worse and so on? ( I think the last guy she was dancing with may have been rather critical that she couldn't follow his "advanced" moves ) She was in such a tiz that if I'd just lead she would have been totally disconected from me. By agreeing to say what each step was, I was also implying that I was willing to dance with her; so she felt safe to relax which let us get connected. Not in a deep profound way, but definitely preferable to where she was 10 seconds ago. And obviously for my "Step left, step right" to be useful she had to be connected to what I was saying. Likewise she still had to stay connected to follow the actual length of each step etc. After about 30 secs I was able to stop saying each move out loud and just lead her

Other ladies have wanted to learn the names of moves and so wanted me to say the name as I did it, as opposed to my saying the name to indicate what they were supposed to do.

Others were wanted to know if they had got the hang of following moves and preferred to name a move and get me to lead it and then deciding whether to do it again or move onto another one. This is particularly interesting when they can remember the names of the moves, but not which name goes with which move. So again it's a case of "please lead a first move and we'll see if I can follow it" rather than "please lead a first move because I'm going to do the follow to it now regardless". Which is important because I've been known to lead the wrong move

In each case I was establishing a better connection by agreeing to dance with them.

Originally Posted by Freya

Shhhh Don't tell anyone I'm crap! *wink*

I'm very comfortable chatting to you

Originally Posted by Freya

Don't do it! IMOFI It ruins the dance!

Strictly by request - although it is a good practice exercise in giving a clear lead for each step if you can name each part slightly before you lead it, but only under practice conditions. In freestyle it's probably "Justifiable homicide" for the follow

[David Bailey]

Originally Posted by FirstMove

Connection is dancing like Franck, or Dave B. No-one else knows what it is, or if they do then they're not telling.

I'm going to go out on a limb here and assume that Amir could hazard a guess too.

As indeed could any number of (admittedly mostly non-MJ) dance teachers.

[ducasi]

Originally Posted by DavidJames

As indeed could any number of (admittedly mostly non-MJ) dance teachers.

Only because most dance teachers are not MJ teachers.

[David Bailey]

Originally Posted by ducasi

Only because most dance teachers are not MJ teachers.

No, because unfortunately, the level of training available to MJ teachers (in terms of teaching dance technique) is, well, non-existent compared to other disciplines.

For example, if you take forms like ballroom, you've got:
The Council for Dance Education and Training
International Dance Teachers Association
English Amateur Dance Association
Imperial Society of Teachers of Dancing
etc.

You've got syllabi, you've got disciplines, you've got volumes of research and technique.

In MJ, you've got... err... the Ceroc Book Of Moves.

[MartinHarper]

Originally Posted by Ghost

If you have no connection in the first place, how do you get some?

Everyone has some connection skills. We start learning that stuff in childhood, holding hands to cross the road. This is just as well, as it's impossible to lead/follow anything if you genuinely have no connection.

[Ghost]

Originally Posted by MartinHarper

Everyone has some connection skills. We start learning that stuff in childhood, holding hands to cross the road. This is just as well, as it's impossible to lead/follow anything if you genuinely have no connection.

Basically you can apply connection skills you've already learned to Ceroc. Which is why I don't think it's a skill restricted to the "chosen few". Realising this however is another matter, as is realising that connection is important in the first place.

[Lynn]

Originally Posted by MartinHarper

Everyone has some connection skills. We start learning that stuff in childhood, holding hands to cross the road. This is just as well, as it's impossible to lead/follow anything if you genuinely have no connection.

Interesting comment as it made me think about a past hobby of mine which was riding. I had to communicate with my pony through touch with legs, hands and voice. I read his feelings about things through how he moved and responded. And I could lead him round an open yard/field with only a light hand on his upper neck (without headcollar or bridle).

I'm not saying men are like animals ( ) but it did make me think about connection and communication.

[Gadget]

With Ducasi's talk of fingertip leading being a 'whisper', I read that as the intensity of the connection more than simply applying it to the physical part of the lead. The way to increase the intensity people seem to be putting forward is to increase the pressure/strength (and change to a 'hand' hold rather than fingertip hold).

I think that the fingertips can feel the lightest of touches (You can tell immediately when you loose contact, no matter how light the connection. You can feel the draught from passing air with your fingertips.) Why increase the pressure?
If you want to increase the intensity of the connection, then you simply add more points of contact that all say the same thing. No heavier or lighter, just working together. This {I think} is the secret to DavidB and Franck's great connection - clarity is achieved through every contact point or signal being given working towards the one, unified goal.
In a hand hold, they are not leading with their hand, but with at least three contact points within the hand, each of the fingers, and their whole body movement: each connection whispering to the follower where to move. Their subtlety comes from varying some of these connections and providing shades of leading rather than a simple 'clear lead' that the rest of us mere mortals are trying to achieve.


{PS: Freya, quoting Franck as having a good connection is cheating: that's his speciality. }

[ducasi]

Originally Posted by Gadget

With Ducasi's talk of fingertip leading being a 'whisper', I read that as the intensity of the connection more than simply applying it to the physical part of the lead. The way to increase the intensity people seem to be putting forward is to increase the pressure/strength (and change to a 'hand' hold rather than fingertip hold).

I think that the fingertips can feel the lightest of touches [...]

I didn't and wouldn't describe fingertip leading as a "whisper". I compared it to tickling, to show how a fingertip can sometimes beat the intensity of a whole hand – so quite the reverse to whispering.

[Caro]

Originally Posted by Gadget

With Ducasi's talk of fingertip leading being a 'whisper'...

It's me who compared fingertip connection / lead to a whisper, building on a connection / sound metaphor from NZM. Do I post in invisible ink ?