Was the intermediate class tonight at that place in W5 too complex??

Jon L · 13th-November-2003, 12:46 AM

Tonight Viktor was teaching a complicated intermediate class tonight at that well known place in London W5.

I was there, so too was Andy McG and Sue, Sheepman and Wendy, Daisy, Pammy, Will, Divissima, David and Lily B and others.

Now I have the greatest respect for Viktor who teaches some cracking stuff , but I have to say that there were five moves. The first was easy, two and three were more tricky, four and five were complex. I have to say he should have simplified 5 down, and I think I could see it caused Will problems. So if the Britroc open champion can't get it - then there ain't much hope for the rest of us.

The other thing I did come off thinking is where an earth I am going to use that last move in freestyle!

So over to the rest of you do you think tonights was a bit too long and possibly over complex???

*Andy McGregor* · 13th-November-2003, 01:39 AM

Firstly, I use the last move in freestlye all the time. It's called the cheek-to-cheek. But when I do it with people I haven't danced with before I often get the impression my partner hasn't done it before. I just about got the whole routine but I agree that it wasn't easy and was dependent on who you got in the girlie raffle that was move on 7 ladies.

There was one move in the whole thing that was completely new to me - and that was the second part of the first one, which as JonL says was quite easy. I like that move because it is a Viktor classic and makes me look like him when I do it - which is what I now do when I'm not looking like Lily

**Tiggerbabe** · 13th-November-2003, 09:27 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Andy McGregor
Firstly, I use the last move in freestlye all the time. It's called the cheek-to-cheek

Which cheeks are we talking about here Andy?
If it's the ones I'm thinking of

then Alex (from Dundee) does that move quite often too - it's a good, fun move and I'm sure Lorna taught it at an Aberdeen party a while ago.

Sure there was another thread somewhere which berated the teachers for not teaching more complicated moves..............seems they can't win

TheTramp · 13th-November-2003, 09:56 AM

I think that the trouble is, that a lot of people are basically fairly selfish (NB. This is NOT a criticism of any one person at all, but rather a perceived outlook, and I might be wrong, it's happened before. Often.).

It's the same with the music played.

They want it to be right for them. And if it's not right for them, they don't care that other people might be benefitting.

Just because someone like Will might be struggling with a particular move, doesn't mean that other people will. Everyone has their own style, so if a move doesn't really fit in with that style, then they will maybe struggle, doesn't matter how good they are. Also, sometimes classes have to challenge the better people. It makes it harder on the newer intermediates admittedly. But if the better people aren't challenged, and never feel that they are learning something, then why would they bother turning up? Sometimes, the classes would (should?) be a lot easier, giving the newer intermediates more encouragement.

When I was teaching a regular class, I would teach a hard class, then a medium class, then an easy class, then a medium class every month. Would announce it before the class, so that if it were a hard class, people who had just made the step up, or were thinking about it, might decide to do the consolidation class that week. Also, the more advanced dancers, on the harder weeks, would join in, and not just sit around chatting during the class. If it were an easy class, then people who were thinking of stepping up, would (hopefully) have a go.

It can't be right for everyone (both the music, and the teaching) all the time. Just maybe think about being a little more tolerant when it's not right for you. Of course, if it's never right for you, then you have the option of going someplace else, or something....

(Please note again, this was not directed at any one person, nor was it said just because of any previous posts in this thread. Just something that I feel the need to say from time to time

).

Steve

ChrisA · 13th-November-2003, 10:41 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by TheTramp
It can't be right for everyone (both the music, and the teaching) all the time. Just maybe think about being a little more tolerant when it's not right for you.

I agree with all Steve says... but what is "right" for someone in a class?

Not "the same as what I'm used to", surely?
Nor "the moves I'd do in freestyle" (just do them then)

Even a class that, at the time, feels exceptionally difficult, can make other, not so hard classes feel easier than they would have done otherwise. And over time, can prove to be very beneficial.

I was too late last night to get to Viktor's class; I watched the second half of it and it looked hardish... but I find Amir's classes very difficult _all_ the time (the moves may be simple, usually, but the technique is not, for me, anyway), and often come out of them feeling like my nerves have been shredded, and I'm one inch tall. Not a nice feeling.

But over time, I can feel the benefit those classes have brought, and that _is_ a nice feeling.

So I say, bring on the hard classes. Mix in some not so hard ones, exactly as Steve was saying, but at venues where the folk can take it, and Hipsters definitely is one of those, let's keep the challenge level high.

Chris

PS ref the other thread... "my" beginner who's been coming to the Wednesday nights for a few weeks now did say to me that the class was hard... but has it put her off? Has it hell...

**foxylady** · 13th-November-2003, 10:45 AM

Chris,

as you are one of the few men in Amirs' class who manage to get the moves and do them with any degree of style, I think you are being rather hard on yourself....

Missed you at Hammersmith last sat, and huge shame you won't be at Camber!

FL

*Andy McGregor* · 13th-November-2003, 10:56 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by ChrisA
PS ref the other thread... "my" beginner who's been coming to the Wednesday nights for a few weeks now did say to me that the class was hard... but has it put her off? Has it hell...

I hope your 'my' beginner is not the same person as my 'my' beginner - choose your weapons, sir

p.s. Last night's cheek to cheek had us looking on opposite directions if that helps identify the particular cheeds that were 'to' each other

p.p.s. My weapon is, as always, The Tramp

**Will** · 13th-November-2003, 11:06 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Jon L
I have to say he should have simplified 5 down, and I think I could see it caused Will problems.

Only move 5 eh? If you'd watched me more closely, you'd have seen moves 1-4 massacred as well

Seriously, my opinion on it is that Hipsters have positioned themselves in the market at the advanced end. They state that in there blurb on their website, they've hired the teachers needed to provide that level on a weekly basis, and indeed they call the class "Advanced" rather than "Intermediate" I believe, so you have to expect a more difficult class that your average intermediate Ceroc class.

I think that alot (though not all) of the best moves take alot longer than 30 minutes to learn / be able to do well, and I think if ever there is a place to teach those moves then it has to be Viktors advanced class at Hipsters.

Anyone can take away 1 or 2 of their favourite moves from the class and then go and practise them in private to get them right.

I guess that at the end of the day, it all depends on what you expect from the class that will define whether you think it was good or not. My personal point of view is that Hipsters have written "Advanced" on the tin, so that is what I want to see.

Agree that 5 moves in the time available was a bit much though.

Will

**DavidB** · 13th-November-2003, 11:15 AM

You also have to remember that Will has problems doing a simple return, and took weeks to master the yoyo.

(When I say master, I mean managing to stay vertical throughout the move, and with the lady in one piece)

*Andy McGregor* · 13th-November-2003, 11:56 AM

I think Will is absolutely right about the Tuesday Hipsters class. It is an, unashamedly, advanced class. I remember on the opening night, before Nigel started teaching the class he made a little speech about the level of difficulty of his class. He put it quite subtly, but to put it bluntly the message was that he would be teahing an advanced class and if you didn't get it you weren't an advanced dancer. I then saw it as a test of my dancing ability. I can't, honestly, remember if I got the whole routine but I do remember he taught the 'tumble dryer' which I'd been trying to get someone to show me for ages. The Tuesday is still an advanced class and if it wasn't for the Wednesday it would be my favourite class in spite of the fast Lindy music and Hotsh*ts.

Now to the Wednesday. It is not an advanced class but there are loads of advanced dancers there - some so advanced that they don't feel the need to do the lesson at all and just sit chatting and occasonally watching (this is a trait of Hostsh*ts but not enough to become a Hotsh*t on it's own, you guys are smiling too much and still need to work on your looks of disdain and boredom - plus you need to start turning people down a bit

). There is a beginners class on Wednesdays and there is a class for them to progress on to. This could be called an intermediate class but I think it should really just be called a Modern Jive Lesson. Last night's routine was one of the hardest Viktor had taught because there were so many moves in such a short time - but I had just about got it by the end because there were some moves I already knew. On other occasions Viktor has taught shorter routines in a longer time and there has been a move I've not quite got by the end and there's been loads I can't remember by the following day. But EVERY single lesson I've had from Viktor has taught me something new. I may not have got the whole thing in the timing Viktor used or might have struggled with one of his stylish, twisty, wristy moves, but there's always been something in there for me. This is what's great for me about Wednesdays when compared to, for example, the class I went to the night before where the teacher could have written the moves in the routine on a blackboard and I could have done it straight off. I still did the whole lesson as I think that doing the lesson if you're there is the same as dancing with beginners - it's putting something back in and ensuring there's good partners in the future.

Oh yes, and while I'm having a rant, here's another one that I haven't seen at HIpsters but have seen in most other places. Why do some guys walk out into the line at the start of the lesson and hold their hand up for a woman to join them? Is this good manners? Couldn't they go and ask a woman to join them? To me it looks like they're saying the equivalent of "Have a woman washed and brought to my room". When I fully become Lily I'll never, ever do anything that would make those guys take their hand down - in other words girls, don't stand in front of them when they do that, just join the line of waiting women or ask a guy to be your partner in the lesson

Perhaps a quizzical or disgusted look would be appropriate too

ChrisA · 13th-November-2003, 11:57 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Andy McGregor
I hope your 'my' beginner is not the same person as my 'my' beginner - choose your weapons, sir

Feel free to share her, Andy, I've warned her about you so she's not scared any more

"My beginner" is just shorthand for "a lady who started dancing about 6 weeks ago, is dead keen to improve ASAP, and who started coming along to H on a Wed at my suggestion".

I ramble on too much as it is

, I have to find some abbreviations...

Chris

*Andy McGregor* · 13th-November-2003, 01:17 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by ChrisA
"My beginner" is just shorthand for "a lady who started dancing about 6 weeks ago, is dead keen to improve ASAP, and who started coming along to H on a Wed at my suggestion".

No, your 'my' beginner is not my 'my' beginner. Back in the mists of time (last summer) when Wednesdays were more cosy (30-40 people) Nigel and I took a consolidation lesson with 3 ladies who'd just started. For a long time, and possibly even now, this particular beginner saw me and Nigel as equal in the firmament of dance stars - so she holds a special place in my heart

**Franck** · 13th-November-2003, 01:50 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Andy McGregor
I think Will is absolutely right about the Tuesday Hipsters class. It is an, unashamedly, advanced class.
..../snip/....
I can't, honestly, remember if I got the whole routine but I do remember he taught the 'tumble dryer' which I'd been trying to get someone to show me for ages.

I am still trying to define what an advanced class is... So many different versions of Advanced have been talked about in this thread and others...
Is an Advanced class lots of complicated moves?
Is an Advanced class lots of 'key points' and added style / footwork / technique?
Is an Advanced class a routine choreographed to a current fave track?
Is an Advanced class any move as long as it's taught by an Advanced teacher?
Is it all of the above???

I personally hate the word Advanced as it conjures up (in my view) the worst form of elitism, where people get upset because they are not considered 'advanced' enough by other (self proclaimed) advanced dancers

The cheek to cheek or the Tumble drier are fun moves to do, and I wouldn't necessarily call them advanced, as long as they were taught by someone who not only can dance the move but can also understand how it works, and therefore how to teach it.

Quote:

There is a beginners class on Wednesdays and there is a class for them to progress on to. This could be called an intermediate class but I think it should really just be called a Modern Jive Lesson. Last night's routine was one of the hardest Viktor had taught because there were so many moves in such a short time - but I had just about got it by the end because there were some moves I already knew.

Too many moves is a big turn-off, but I can understand that Viktor would have tried to cater for the regular Wednesday crowd as well as the more 'Advanced' Tuesday visitors...

It now looks like Hipsters having captured an audience by calling itself Advanced is reverting to the tried and tested Ceroc formula of having a Beginners class followed by an Intermediate class, albeit with excellent teachers (all of them ex-Ceroc

)

and no wonder!

Franck.

Geordieed · 13th-November-2003, 02:01 PM

This thread seems to have captured a few imaginations. You know there could have been a little bit of promotion in the class last night. Yes 5 moves is alot but with a bigger audience to show your teaching wears might help to increase the class size for Wednesday. Freestyle was a rush hour nightmare. It is good to have your dancing challenged.

If you aced all the moves straight away it may encourage some people that they don't need to do classes anymore. Thoughts on that one.

I found a handful of the tracks that Roger played last night alot more challenging to be honest.

One last thing for those regulars. You know that Viktor has been simplifying the moves done in the classes and as last week illustrated showed a little more on style and technique. Most helpful and gave you a greater insight into what is out there for a dancer to consider.

ChrisA · 13th-November-2003, 02:15 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Andy McGregor
this particular beginner saw me and Nigel as equal in the firmament of dance stars - so she holds a special place in my heart

Bless

ChrisA · 13th-November-2003, 02:19 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Geordieed
One last thing for those regulars. You know that Viktor has been simplifying the moves done in the classes

And there I was thinking that I was improving...

Doh!!

Chris

**DavidB** · 13th-November-2003, 03:28 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Franck
I personally hate the word Advanced as it conjures up (in my view) the worst form of elitism, where people get upset because they are not considered 'advanced' enough

Political correctness in Modern Jive???

But I do see your point. 'Advanced' classes shouldn't be thought of as classes for Advanced dancers. They should be classes that introduce and develop more advanced ideas in dancing.

A teacher would never aim an 'Advanced' class at 'Advanced' dancers anyway. If you are doing the class to actively learn something, it is because you want to get to a particular level, not because you are already at that level. If Nigel or Viktor or Amir actually did a classes aimed at an Advanced level (ie their level), then there would hardly be anyone who could do it!

Challenging intermediate classes like Viktor's yesterday may be hard, but it doesn't make them advanced.

The word 'Advanced' just follows on from the use of 'Beginner' and 'Intermediate' You could argue that 'Intermediate' doesn't do many of the people who do them justice. It implies that they are just average, and have some way to go. Is there a difference between telling someone "you are intermediate" and "you are not advanced"?

I've seen 'Beginner', 'General', 'Fast-Paced' and 'Technique' used to describe classes at my gym - perhaps something like this may be more descriptive.

Quote:

by other (self proclaimed) advanced dancers.

In the absence of any standard grading system for modern jive (which most people, including myself, are against) then any 'advanced' dancer has to be self-proclaimed.

Quote:

It now looks like Hipsters having captured an audience by calling itself Advanced is reverting to the tried and tested Ceroc formula of having a Beginners class followed by an Intermediate class

Similarly you might be able to argue that Ceroc are following the Hipsters formula by starting to offer more advanced classes. (I say might because there hasn't been any official anouncement on what Ceroc are planning. I'm just reading between the lines.)

**Franck** · 13th-November-2003, 03:49 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DavidB
Political correctness in Modern Jive???

But I do see your point. 'Advanced' classes shouldn't be thought of as classes for Advanced dancers. They should be classes that introduce and develop more advanced ideas in dancing.

Political correctess? me? nah!
I totally agree with your definition of what Advanced should mean, unfortunately, it is often perceived very differently...

Quote:

The word 'Advanced' just follows on from the use of 'Beginner' and 'Intermediate' You could argue that 'Intermediate' doesn't do many of the people who do them justice. It implies that they are just average, and have some way to go. Is there a difference between telling someone "you are intermediate" and "you are not advanced"?

Yes, there is a huge difference, at least there was until some classes appeared that called themselves 'advanced'. Before that, there was a general level known as Beginners, and beyond that, everyone was considered Intermediate, this implied that while everyone's abilities were obviously different, they all belonged to the same group, and that improving in one direction didn't necessarily raise you above the others, just made you different.

Quote:

In the absence of any standard grading system for modern jive (which most people, including myself, are against) then any 'advanced' dancer has to be self-proclaimed.

Not quite, some excellent dancers are not self-proclaimed, but publically acclaimed

including yourself in that category...

Quote:

Similarly you might be able to argue that Ceroc are following the Hipsters formula by starting to offer more advanced classes. (I say might because there hasn't been any official anouncement on what Ceroc are planning. I'm just reading between the lines.)

Of course, Ceroc is watching what is happening, and over the last 12 years when I've been involved, many things have changed, improved etc...
I don't recall implying that Ceroc was going to offer more Advanced classes, though, we are all looking at how we can improve the standard and format of the existing classes. There will be more technique / style taught at workshops and during the classes, but I personally would resist any change to introduce an Advanced label on the classes.

Franck.

Jon L · 14th-November-2003, 12:31 AM

Quote:

Now to the Wednesday. It is not an advanced class but there are loads of advanced dancers there - some so advanced that they don't feel the need to do the lesson at all and just sit chatting and occasonally watching (this is a trait of Hostsh*ts but not enough to become a Hotsh*t on it's own, you guys are smiling too much and still need to work on your looks of disdain and boredom - plus you need to start turning people down a bit ). There is a beginners class on Wednesdays and there is a class for them to progress on to. This could be called an intermediate class but I think it should really just be called a Modern Jive Lesson. Last night's routine was one of the hardest Viktor had taught because there were so many moves in such a short time - but I had just about got it by the end because there were some moves I already knew. On other occasions Viktor has taught shorter routines in a longer time and there has been a move I've not quite got by the end and there's been loads I can't remember by the following day. But EVERY single lesson I've had from Viktor has taught me something new. I may not have got the whole thing in the timing Viktor used or might have struggled with one of his stylish, twisty, wristy moves, but there's always been something in there for me. This is what's great for me about Wednesdays when compared to, for example, the class I went to the night before where the teacher could have written the moves in the routine on a blackboard and I could have done it straight off. I still did the whole lesson as I think that doing the lesson if you're there is the same as dancing with beginners - it's putting something back in and ensuring there's good partners in the future.

My goodness I have started an interesting thread here. If you remember the colour scheme I siggested for Bognor or Camber (see Dance section), last nights was a definate red (competant intermediate class) - I am all for these, as Will has agreed with me the main problem was the time we had and that last move. Problem was you were going one way and then the other - and this caused me brain ache - what brain I hear you ask

?

Daisy · 14th-November-2003, 12:52 AM

(Now to the Wednesday. It is not an advanced class but there ae loads of advanced dancers there - some so advanced that they don't feel the need to do the lesson at all and just sit chatting and occasonally watching (this is a trait of Hostsh*ts )
__________________________________________________ _
What is wrong with sitting out of the lesson if you so wish?! One of these days your halo is going to fall off...... Saint Andy!

That lesson was soooo... crowded last night that it didn't look much fun trying to do all 5 moves in a space the size of a postage stamp!

Live and let live I say. You do what you want and let others choose for themselves without being critised ALL the time!

Was that a S..T sters tee- shirt you were wearing last night?

You know you love a woman that fights back!

13th-November-2003, 12:46 AM	#1 (permalink)
Jon L Registered User Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Surrey Posts: 449 Rep Power: 3	Was the intermediate class tonight at that place in W5 too complex?? Tonight Viktor was teaching a complicated intermediate class tonight at that well known place in London W5. I was there, so too was Andy McG and Sue, Sheepman and Wendy, Daisy, Pammy, Will, Divissima, David and Lily B and others. Now I have the greatest respect for Viktor who teaches some cracking stuff , but I have to say that there were five moves. The first was easy, two and three were more tricky, four and five were complex. I have to say he should have simplified 5 down, and I think I could see it caused Will problems. So if the Britroc open champion can't get it - then there ain't much hope for the rest of us. The other thing I did come off thinking is where an earth I am going to use that last move in freestyle! So over to the rest of you do you think tonights was a bit too long and possibly over complex???

13th-November-2003, 09:56 AM	#4 (permalink)
TheTramp The Forum Legend Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Dundee, Scotland Posts: 10,492 Rep Power: 6	I think that the trouble is, that a lot of people are basically fairly selfish (NB. This is NOT a criticism of any one person at all, but rather a perceived outlook, and I might be wrong, it's happened before. Often.). It's the same with the music played. They want it to be right for them. And if it's not right for them, they don't care that other people might be benefitting. Just because someone like Will might be struggling with a particular move, doesn't mean that other people will. Everyone has their own style, so if a move doesn't really fit in with that style, then they will maybe struggle, doesn't matter how good they are. Also, sometimes classes have to challenge the better people. It makes it harder on the newer intermediates admittedly. But if the better people aren't challenged, and never feel that they are learning something, then why would they bother turning up? Sometimes, the classes would (should?) be a lot easier, giving the newer intermediates more encouragement. When I was teaching a regular class, I would teach a hard class, then a medium class, then an easy class, then a medium class every month. Would announce it before the class, so that if it were a hard class, people who had just made the step up, or were thinking about it, might decide to do the consolidation class that week. Also, the more advanced dancers, on the harder weeks, would join in, and not just sit around chatting during the class. If it were an easy class, then people who were thinking of stepping up, would (hopefully) have a go. It can't be right for everyone (both the music, and the teaching) all the time. Just maybe think about being a little more tolerant when it's not right for you. Of course, if it's never right for you, then you have the option of going someplace else, or something.... (Please note again, this was not directed at any one person, nor was it said just because of any previous posts in this thread. Just something that I feel the need to say from time to time ). Steve __________________ "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it". (Attributed to Voltaire). Caveat: But reserve the right to tell you if what you say is a load of crap!

13th-November-2003, 10:45 AM	#6 (permalink)
foxylady The Perfect Woman! Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: London Posts: 931 Rep Power: 3	amirs' classes Chris, as you are one of the few men in Amirs' class who manage to get the moves and do them with any degree of style, I think you are being rather hard on yourself.... Missed you at Hammersmith last sat, and huge shame you won't be at Camber! FL

13th-November-2003, 11:15 AM	#9 (permalink)
DavidB Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 2,138 Rep Power: 5	Re: Re: Was the intermediate class tonight at that place in W5 too complex?? You also have to remember that Will has problems doing a simple return, and took weeks to master the yoyo. (When I say master, I mean managing to stay vertical throughout the move, and with the lady in one piece)

13th-November-2003, 01:39 AM	#2 (permalink)
Andy McGregor Commercial Operator Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Sussex by the Sea Posts: 7,275 Rep Power: 5	Firstly, I use the last move in freestlye all the time. It's called the cheek-to-cheek. But when I do it with people I haven't danced with before I often get the impression my partner hasn't done it before. I just about got the whole routine but I agree that it wasn't easy and was dependent on who you got in the girlie raffle that was move on 7 ladies. There was one move in the whole thing that was completely new to me - and that was the second part of the first one, which as JonL says was quite easy. I like that move because it is a Viktor classic and makes me look like him when I do it - which is what I now do when I'm not looking like Lily

13th-November-2003, 11:56 AM	#10 (permalink)
Andy McGregor Commercial Operator Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Sussex by the Sea Posts: 7,275 Rep Power: 5	I think Will is absolutely right about the Tuesday Hipsters class. It is an, unashamedly, advanced class. I remember on the opening night, before Nigel started teaching the class he made a little speech about the level of difficulty of his class. He put it quite subtly, but to put it bluntly the message was that he would be teahing an advanced class and if you didn't get it you weren't an advanced dancer. I then saw it as a test of my dancing ability. I can't, honestly, remember if I got the whole routine but I do remember he taught the 'tumble dryer' which I'd been trying to get someone to show me for ages. The Tuesday is still an advanced class and if it wasn't for the Wednesday it would be my favourite class in spite of the fast Lindy music and Hotshts. Now to the Wednesday. It is not an advanced class but there are loads of advanced dancers there - some so advanced that they don't feel the need to do the lesson at all and just sit chatting and occasonally watching (this is a trait of Hostshts but not enough to become a Hotsh*t on it's own, you guys are smiling too much and still need to work on your looks of disdain and boredom - plus you need to start turning people down a bit ). There is a beginners class on Wednesdays and there is a class for them to progress on to. This could be called an intermediate class but I think it should really just be called a Modern Jive Lesson. Last night's routine was one of the hardest Viktor had taught because there were so many moves in such a short time - but I had just about got it by the end because there were some moves I already knew. On other occasions Viktor has taught shorter routines in a longer time and there has been a move I've not quite got by the end and there's been loads I can't remember by the following day. But EVERY single lesson I've had from Viktor has taught me something new. I may not have got the whole thing in the timing Viktor used or might have struggled with one of his stylish, twisty, wristy moves, but there's always been something in there for me. This is what's great for me about Wednesdays when compared to, for example, the class I went to the night before where the teacher could have written the moves in the routine on a blackboard and I could have done it straight off. I still did the whole lesson as I think that doing the lesson if you're there is the same as dancing with beginners - it's putting something back in and ensuring there's good partners in the future. Oh yes, and while I'm having a rant, here's another one that I haven't seen at HIpsters but have seen in most other places. Why do some guys walk out into the line at the start of the lesson and hold their hand up for a woman to join them? Is this good manners? Couldn't they go and ask a woman to join them? To me it looks like they're saying the equivalent of "Have a woman washed and brought to my room". When I fully become Lily I'll never, ever do anything that would make those guys take their hand down - in other words girls, don't stand in front of them when they do that, just join the line of waiting women or ask a guy to be your partner in the lesson Perhaps a quizzical or disgusted look would be appropriate too

13th-November-2003, 02:01 PM	#14 (permalink)
Geordieed Registered User Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 456 Rep Power: 3	This thread seems to have captured a few imaginations. You know there could have been a little bit of promotion in the class last night. Yes 5 moves is alot but with a bigger audience to show your teaching wears might help to increase the class size for Wednesday. Freestyle was a rush hour nightmare. It is good to have your dancing challenged. If you aced all the moves straight away it may encourage some people that they don't need to do classes anymore. Thoughts on that one. I found a handful of the tracks that Roger played last night alot more challenging to be honest. One last thing for those regulars. You know that Viktor has been simplifying the moves done in the classes and as last week illustrated showed a little more on style and technique. Most helpful and gave you a greater insight into what is out there for a dancer to consider.

14th-November-2003, 12:52 AM	#20 (permalink)
Daisy Registered User Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: AUSTRALIA Posts: 397 Rep Power: 3	(Now to the Wednesday. It is not an advanced class but there ae loads of advanced dancers there - some so advanced that they don't feel the need to do the lesson at all and just sit chatting and occasonally watching (this is a trait of Hostsh*ts ) __________________________________________________ _ What is wrong with sitting out of the lesson if you so wish?! One of these days your halo is going to fall off...... Saint Andy! That lesson was soooo... crowded last night that it didn't look much fun trying to do all 5 moves in a space the size of a postage stamp! Live and let live I say. You do what you want and let others choose for themselves without being critised ALL the time! Was that a S..T sters tee- shirt you were wearing last night? You know you love a woman that fights back!