Catching the lady's hand...

[David Bailey]

Yet another thing I find difficult (amazing I can dance at all really ):

I sometimes want to lead a move that starts out with me behind, the lady in front, both facing the same way (i.e. lady facing front), and both with arms spread out wide and to either side (double hand hold, L-L and R-R). Usually this move is one of those flashy-footwork things by the lady, maybe with a dip and slow wiggly rise. Mmm, lovely move....

Anyway, is there an elegant way to catch the lady's left hand from a return, or to signal "Hold your left hand out", without actually shouting that?

I can grab the lady's left hand, no problem, but this is usually from a sway-type move, and I'd like to do it from a return. But whenever I try, it looks awkward...

So, any tips on arm-catching?

[Graham]

If you trail your left hand across her back as she's returning then this is both a signal, and also should allow you to continue trailing up her arm and catch her hand. Even if it doesn't exactly work, your left hand will be in an "offer" position and since you're already holding on to her right hand she should take it with her left.

[El Salsero Gringo]

So you're trying to lead a return with the right hand and collect the lady's spare left hand with your left? The back-trailing thing should work, but in my head I'm finding the return a bit awkward.

How about doing it while swapping places, so it starts like a catapault, you trail the back and take the spare arm as the lady steps past you and you turn to face. Lower the left, raise the right over the lady's head to turn her 180 as you both step in, et voila.

[El Salsero Gringo]

Or else execute a swift Neck-Break-Cleaver-Hook, keeping hold of both hands and ending on quick anti-clockwise spin for the lady.

[spindr]

Originally Posted by DavidJames

Anyway, is there an elegant way to catch the lady's left hand from a return, or to signal "Hold your left hand out", without actually shouting that?

Definitely agree with the trailing down the shoulder and arm technique.

Of course, you could simply offer your hand for the follower to take -- although a lot of MJ followers are usually surprised that you might want to take their left hand (maybe they're all right-handed ).

My favourite sneaky hand change is simply to lead a right-to-right lady comb and then let my right hand drop behind the lady's shoulder so that I can easily take her left arm (which is usually just hanging at her side ) as we step apart.

Or failing that -- lead a basket and a return and swap the hands at the apex of the return

SpinDr.

[MartinHarper]

I've heard this move called a crucifix, but I've never seen an entrance directly from a one-handed return: normally the other hand is picked up from a preceding move, such as an accordion or sway.

[Rhythm King]

Originally Posted by El Salsero Gringo

Or else execute a swift Neck-Break-Cleaver-Hook, keeping hold of both hands and ending on quick anti-clockwise spin for the lady.

Yup, that would do it in my book, or else the anti-clockwise accordian RH comb, release right and offer it under lady's left arm, to unwrap as above into crucifix.

On the other hand, Amir teaches a tango-based move which starts single-handed and has the desired ending, but it relies on the lady having a semi-active follow, with a dynamic spare arm. Seems to work first time, every time for him, less so for us mortals, unless it's just been in the routine he's taught in class and the lady is semi-expecting it.

Not letting go of both hands in a catapult and taking your right over your head then over hers as she turns clockwise to your left side would work too, but of course that wouldn't be from a single handed entry would it? I'll shut up and get back in my box now

[David Bailey]

Great suggestions, guys...

Originally Posted by MartinHarper

I've heard this move called a crucifix, but I've never seen an entrance directly from a one-handed return: normally the other hand is picked up from a preceding move, such as an accordion or sway.

That's probably why I'm finding it tricky (good name, BTW!).

The move I'd like to do, to lead into it, is a right-hand-led cross-body, with return, into that crucifix position. And yes, it's yet another port from salsa - my longterm aim to dance only salsa in MJ

So for that, I dunno if the trailing-hand-over-shoulder thing is workable, it'll might look awkward... OTOH, if I can do it late enough in the move it might work.

The catapult-y suggestions sound like they'd work... nice, actually. But I don't think it'd fit into the sequence I have in my head.

Originally Posted by El Salsero Gringo

Or else execute a swift Neck-Break-Cleaver-Hook

Tell me you're making that one up....

Originally Posted by Rhythm King

On the other hand, Amir teaches a tango-based move which starts single-handed and has the desired ending, but it relies on the lady having a semi-active follow, with a dynamic spare arm.

You know, I suspect that's what I need. If I could in some way indicate to the lady that she should stick her hand out, that'd be ideal.

Hmmm, guinea-pigs needed, methinks

[Feelingpink]

Originally Posted by DavidJames

...

I sometimes want to lead a move that starts out with me behind, the lady in front, both facing the same way (i.e. lady facing front), and both with arms spread out wide and to either side (double hand hold, L-L and R-R). Usually this move is one of those flashy-footwork things by the lady, maybe with a dip and slow wiggly rise. Mmm, lovely move....

Andy McGregor kept doing this move on Monday night at Jango ... only he was in front Perhaps he could comment?

[El Salsero Gringo]

Originally Posted by Rhythm King

... but it relies on the lady having a semi-active follow, with a dynamic spare arm.

Not possible I'm afraid. The "semi-active follow" was only ever available on the Partner9000 (TM) model, which came with the same hydraulically damped, fully gimballed but passive (unpowered) spare arm as the preceeding type codes. The "dynamic" spare arm wasn't released until the 9050 model (and not in fact really useable until the succeeding model 9100 upgrade) by which time the following circuitry had also been upgraded to a self-correcting servo-assisted fully-active mechanism - the one with the gas-bearings and self-sealing lubrication system.

(And I wonder why no-one wants to dance with me?)

[Feelingpink]

Originally Posted by El Salsero Gringo

Not possible I'm afraid. The "semi-active follow" was only ever available on the Partner9000 (TM) model, which came with the same hydraulically damped, fully gimballed but passive (unpowered) spare arm as the preceeding type codes. The "dynamic" spare arm wasn't released until the 9050 model (and not in fact really useable until the succeeding model 9100 upgrade) by which time the following circuitry had also been upgraded to a self-correcting servo-assisted fully-active mechanism - the one with the gas-bearings and self-sealing lubrication system.

(And I wonder why no-one wants to dance with me?)

Go on, start a poll on whether you would be best suited to talking dance, actually dancing or staying in the kitchen cooking ... I dare you

[Yliander]

Originally Posted by DavidJames

Anyway, is there an elegant way to catch the lady's left hand from a return, or to signal "Hold your left hand out", without actually shouting that?

*snip*

So, any tips on arm-catching?

there is a very easy way to to pick up a ladies hand as you return her.

as you return the lady as her left shoulder passes by you place your right hand on her shoulder blade and trail your hand down and under her arm with your palm up - and wa la you end up in a basic hand hold

this also works if you are returning the lady with your right hand and want to pick up her right hand - just place your left hand on her right shoulder and trail

this way of picking up may seem awkard at first but having taught it during my last three consolidation classes - I can assure you once you are comfortable with it - it flows seamlessly - even with beginners

one of the tricks is to not leave it too late to place your hand on the shoulder - the later you try and place it on the shoulder the more chance you will miss the shoulder as the girl goes past and it will become awkward

[El Salsero Gringo]

Originally Posted by DavidJames

The move I'd like to do, to lead into it, is a right-hand-led cross-body, with return, into that crucifix position. And yes, it's yet another port from salsa - my longterm aim to dance only salsa in MJ

Well then, you should have said so:

Do your cross-body, but on the 1, put your right arm behind the lady's neck to her right shoulder swapping her right hand from your left to your right (a bit like a neck-break, but not quite the same). On 3, open up your "door", on five-six-seven make sure she does an outside turn and take her spare hand as she goes past. Then do your double handed 180 instead of a return so she has her back to you.

Originally Posted by DavidJames

Tell me you're making that one up....

Not at all. Robin showed me that one.

[El Salsero Gringo]

Originally Posted by Feelingpink

Go on, start a poll on whether you would be best suited to talking dance, actually dancing or staying in the kitchen cooking ... I dare you

I would do, but they aren't independent. If my mouth and feet stop moving then my hands stop baking too.

[David Bailey]

Originally Posted by El Salsero Gringo

Well then, you should have said so:

Well yes, but I only worked out why I wanted to do it just now. Besides, if I reveal everything at once, where's the fun in that?

Originally Posted by El Salsero Gringo

Do your cross-body, but on the 1, put your right arm behind the lady's neck to her right shoulder swapping her right hand from your left to your right (a bit like a neck-break, but not quite the same). On 3, open up your "door", on five-six-seven make sure she does an outside turn and take her spare hand as she goes past. Then do your double handed 180 instead of a return so she has her back to you.

Ooh, that sounds good... Except I want to lead it with my right hand up until the crucifix bit. Picky, that's me. Mind you, that's not to say I won't try that version...

Originally Posted by El Salsero Gringo

Not at all. Robin showed me that one.

I was referring to the name, it sounds like something from the Texas Chainsaw Massacre...

[El Salsero Gringo]

Originally Posted by DavidJames

Except I want to lead it with my right hand up until the crucifix bit.

OK then, just lead the cross body with the right hand and loop your right arm over the lady's head on the one-two, instead of swapping hands. The rest as before.

Originally Posted by David James

Picky, that's me.

You said it, buster.

Originally Posted by David James

I was referring to the name, it sounds like something from the Texas Chainsaw Massacre...

And it feels like something from Driller Killer. Looks great though.

[Rhythm King]

Originally Posted by El Salsero Gringo

Not possible I'm afraid. The "semi-active follow" was only ever available on the Partner9000 (TM) model, which came with the same hydraulically damped, fully gimballed but passive (unpowered) spare arm as the preceeding type codes. The "dynamic" spare arm wasn't released until the 9050 model (and not in fact really useable until the succeeding model 9100 upgrade) by which time the following circuitry had also been upgraded to a self-correcting servo-assisted fully-active mechanism - the one with the gas-bearings and self-sealing lubrication system.

(And I wonder why no-one wants to dance with me?)

You've been drinking the mule fuel again, haven't you?

Anyway the Cyberdyne Systems MJ5000 with multi-phase bpm management, infra-red tracking and chrome molybdenum spare arm gimbals is far better than the Partner9000 (so long as you don't get the Sarah Connor edition) as any fule know

[El Salsero Gringo]

Originally Posted by Rhythm King

You've been drinking the mule fuel again, haven't you?

How dare you, sirrah!? I'm actually an ass (as any mule know.)

[Mary]

Methinks the ass has been in the pantry. Somebody lock him in before he wreaks more havoc in the cyberkitchen

M