From "Blues" to "Jango"

[Gadget]

The recent 'thing' seems to be Tango, where connection is king. How does this relate/compare to Blues dancing?
Personally, I think that in terms of leading and forming a raport with your partner, there is a lot that can be taken from one into the other. And from both into MJ.

Any comments?

[Lynn]

Originally Posted by Gadget

The recent 'thing' seems to be Tango, where connection is king. How does this relate/compare to Blues dancing?
Personally, I think that in terms of leading and forming a raport with your partner, there is a lot that can be taken from one into the other. And from both into MJ.

Any comments?

I think that the concepts of interpreting the music, not doing set 'moves' and dancing in closer hold are all things that are present in both blues and Tango. And yes that 'connection' that you sometimes get in blues dancing that makes the dance just

I have actually been thinking about this - on a personal front maybe the lack of any MJ classes for the past 1 1/2 years has actually forced me to improve my following? (Basically I had no opportunites to learn any moves so I had to simply follow, I didn't know how moves were 'supposed' to go. I'm very glad to have classes now though!). I still get it wrong far too often, but if I really relax I can follow OK. That coupled with a personal preference for dancing in the blues room at weekenders has perhaps made it that bit easier for me to transition into Tango?

And yes, despite only starting, I can already see that there are things I will learn in Tango that I can take into MJ - improved following (ever my goal) for one.

[Andy McGregor]

IMHO. Blues is MJ done to slower music. This allows the partners to get closer. Jango is MJ as well. Amir has taken Tango moves and made them fit MJ. At that point they become MJ moves.

And what is MJ? It's dancing to music that's 4 beats to the bar using either all the beats or beat 1 & 3. Both Blues and Jango do this.

[David Bailey]

Originally Posted by Gadget

The recent 'thing' seems to be Tango, where connection is king. How does this relate/compare to Blues dancing?

I pretty much danced Tango-esque most of the time in the Blues room at Chiswick's "Swinging the Blues" thing on Saturday - it seemed to work fine most of the time.

Originally Posted by Andy McGregor

IMHO. Blues is MJ done to slower music.

I dunno, there aren't many MJ moves that work very well when slowed down that much. You can't do spins, or even turns mostly. Sways, yes, but even slow combs may look a bit naff.

My working definition of blues is simply "dancing to very slow music", so that keeps me happy.

[Lynn]

Originally Posted by DavidJames

I dunno, there aren't many MJ moves that work very well when slowed down that much. You can't do spins, or even turns mostly. Sways, yes, but even slow combs may look a bit naff.

My working definition of blues is simply "dancing to very slow music", so that keeps me happy.

You can do spins! A sharp very fast spin followed by a sudden stop and slow wiggle is great (wish I could do it well though!) - its the contrast in the fast and slow that makes it work. My understanding of blues is that it isn't about dancing slow, its about feeling and expressing the music (as opposed to the beat which is more what MJ is about) and that's surely where the similarity to Tango comes in?

[clevedonboy]

Originally Posted by Lynn

My understanding of blues is that it isn't about dancing slow, its about feeling and expressing the music

Absolutely - Blues, the dance, comes from Blues, the music. Clearly it has evolved from the early 20th Century incarnation to include later dance styles (for instance Hollywood style Lindy) but the importance of connection between the dancers and the music is they key. It's not just the pace of the music that makes Blues dancing special but the content be that in the Lyrics (misery and the blues by Maria Muldaur or Let's Rendezvous by Swingerhead being good examples) and the music phrasing (Heart Attack & Vine).

One of the best pieces of advice I had about Blues is to remember that Blues music contains "Call and Response" at it's heart and so should the dance

[David Bailey]

Originally Posted by Lynn

You can do spins! A sharp very fast spin followed by a sudden stop and slow wiggle is great (wish I could do it well though!)

I'll take your word for it

Originally Posted by Lynn

- its the contrast in the fast and slow that makes it work.

You're assuming that there are fast bits of course

Originally Posted by Lynn

My understanding of blues is that it isn't about dancing slow, its about feeling and expressing the music (as opposed to the beat which is more what MJ is about) and that's surely where the similarity to Tango comes in?

I dunno - surely that's what any dancing is about, ultimately?

OK, maybe Blues dancing pushes you into interpretation more (which IMO is a Good Thing), because you can't really just bounce along in a pushme-pullyou manner. Although having said that, that didn't stop one follower trying her best to do that on Saturday with me...

[Lynn]

Originally Posted by DavidJames

I'll take your word for it

Sorry, I misread your post as 'you can't lead spins' - rather than do spins, as lead. Maybe spins for the lead aren't suitable for blues...

Originally Posted by DavidJames

OK, maybe Blues dancing pushes you into interpretation more (which IMO is a Good Thing), because you can't really just bounce along in a pushme-pullyou manner. Although having said that, that didn't stop one follower trying her best to do that on Saturday with me...

Or when the lead does that when the lead does that. I had a dance like at Camber to a very bluesy track (after the upstairs had closed) - and the smoother I tried to dance, the more he bounced - I think he thought I 'wasn't getting' the beat!

[David Bailey]

Originally Posted by Lynn

I had a dance like at Camber to a very bluesy track (after the upstairs had closed) - and the smoother I tried to dance, the more he bounced - I think he thought I 'wasn't getting' the beat!

I think it's very much easier to make a fool of yourself dancing Blues - because the lead is (I think) continuous and relatively subtle, it can be missed, and someone used to following a heavy Ceroc-y lead will assume there's no lead to follow (which is what happened to me).

Since it's continuous and connection-based, it's easy to dance tango-style to it. But sometimes the music doesn't fit, in which case you also look silly.

Hmmm, maybe I should learn this Blues thing at some point; there are only so many sleazy seducers I can do before even ZW gets bored with them

[Lynn]

Originally Posted by DavidJames

Hmmm, maybe I should learn this Blues thing at some point;

Learn what though? If blues is about connection and musical interpretation then surely that's what you are leading anyway? I've only been to a couple of blues classes - but I spend most of my time at weekenders in the blues room so I think I'm dancing blues... One thing I especially like is that aside from a few common things (like the blues hold) there is a big difference in styles amongst leads in a blues room - keeps it interesting!

[Gadget]

Some good points made, unfortunatly I have not had much tutorage on either styles {not that it stops me adding in my 2p }.

I don't think that "blues" dancing is danced very well in general; the 'blusey' bits are brilliant - fantastic connection, subtle leads and movements conveying the feel of the music.
But as soon as the dancers want to express a drama in the music or break from the standard 'blues holds', this connection breaks down and it's just 'slower MJ'.
Comparing this with Tango, I think that the connection is held better through the drama points in the music during tango dances for some reason.

Is tango more a "Heat/passion/fire" type thing and blues more a "Smouldering/intemate/sensual" type thing?

[Lynn]

Originally Posted by Gadget

Is tango more a "Heat/passion/fire" type thing and blues more a "Smouldering/intemate/sensual" type thing?

I would say (from my vast experience ) that Tango can be more smouldering and sensual than blues and more smouldering than fire - its sort of intense and understated at the same time. And perhaps blues has more of a 'humour' element than tango?

[David Bailey]

Originally Posted by Lynn

I would say (from my vast experience ) that Tango can be more smouldering and sensual than blues and more smouldering than fire - its sort of intense and understated at the same time. And perhaps blues has more of a 'humour' element than tango?

Resurrecting this thread in a last-ditch desperate attempt to hit my target...

I dunno if "humour" is correct, but I think Blues seems to occasionally have a "visually playful" element in it. I've never seen any dancers "play" so visually in Tango, although obviously there's vast scope for the lady to do playful decorations, pauses, and other elements at her discretion.

I'm still no closer to a clear definition of "What is Blues?" - however, I'm at least now reassured that this is because there is no clear definition - "slow dancing with style" is the best I could come up with.

Judging from the threads about it ("What exactly is blues?", "Blues for beginners", "What is Blues?", "Blues for beginners", "Blues, UCP, Sinful, Sensual... What are they & how do they differ?" and so on), lots of others also have no clear definition of Blues.

(Although the last thread does talk about the infamous "Bum crack" move, from a year ago )

[Rhythm King]

Originally Posted by DavidJames

(Although the last thread does talk about the infamous "Bum crack" move, from a year ago )

DJ please, that's the "Blues Groove" (according to Nigel, anyway )

[David Bailey]

Originally Posted by Rhythm King

DJ please, that's the "Blues Groove" (according to Nigel, anyway )

Ewww

[Ghost]

Originally Posted by DavidJames

I'm still no closer to a clear definition of "What is Blues?"

Best I can offer is the feeling of

"Just a pair of fallen angels tryin' to get through the night

Step by step, one by one, higher and higher
Step by step, one by one, climbing Jacob's ladder"

Jacobs Ladder ~ Bruce Hornsby And The Range

Dance in beauty,
Christopher