The value of Jordan and Tatiana.....

[FoxyFunkster]

I`ve just returned from the worst weekender IMHO i`ve ever been on @ Jive Time`s Camber, one of the truly poor things about the whole weekend was the generally poor cabarets and the classes so i was wondering about the value ( both monetary and inspirational) of having amazing people like Jordan and Tatiana or Parker and Jessica teaching/showcasing against just having regular MJ teachers ......i`m told that the top top americans cost around 5 grand a weekend which amounts to only putting an extra 50 people through the door @ £100 each....please correct me if i`m wrong with those figures.........so i`m sure if Franco had gone out and got J&T he would have got at least 50 people coming just because of the teaching line up so IMHO it`s a no brainer......i can however see the merits of Ceroc`s policy of only using their own teachers simply because they have such a large pool of great teachers of their own to choose from but a weekender with all the best ceroc has to offer coupled with J&T or P&J would be a must have ticket IMHO.......any thoughts anyone????

[Cruella]

Cue Rocky......

[FoxyFunkster]

Originally Posted by Cruella

Cue Rocky......

oops...have i opened a can of worms here then???

[jiveaddicted]

ive got to say for me the big names make a weekender for me just to have the chance to dance with there people and to see them perform in person. I dont think southport would be the same without if you like a headline act/performance!! And i would not mind in the slightest paying more for my weekend if a dance with tatiana was on the cards

M

[FoxyFunkster]

Originally Posted by FoxyFunkster

oops...have i opened a can of worms here then???

Also can we try to avoid derailing this thread to a Jive Addiction V Ceroc slanging match....Lets please keep it civil please.....We`re all lovers/dancers not fighters....

[FoxyFunkster]

Originally Posted by jiveaddicted

ive got to say for me the big names make a weekender for me just to have the chance to dance with there people and to see them perform in person. I dont think southport would be the same without if you like a headline act/performance!! And i would not mind in the slightest paying more for my weekend if a dance with tatiana was on the cards

M

I do think being inspired by people is what we all love to feel.....i can remeber being inspired when i first saw my Ceroc teacher demo the intermediate class at my 1st ceroc night....More inspirational people please......

[Astro]

It's a shame when a big name is advertised, but has to cancel.

[drathzel]

I have said it before on another thread but i would personally prefer to see the likes of Simon and Nicole and Marc And Rachel etc at a weekender than the likes of the American big names.

I dont see any harm in big names but i think its great to have no names too, you normally expect less but get more!

[FoxyFunkster]

Originally Posted by drathzel

I have said it before on another thread but i would personally prefer to see the likes of Simon and Nicole and Marc And Rachel etc at a weekender than the likes of the American big names.

I dont see any harm in big names but i think its great to have no names too, you normally expect less but get more!

i can see your point.....but not having been taught or seen Parker and Jessica before i have to say they were amazing....even just to watch their showcases live was awesome....

[Keith J]

Originally Posted by FoxyFunkster

I` ......i`m told that the top top americans cost around 5 grand a weekend which amounts to only putting an extra 50 people through the door @ £100 each....please correct me if i`m wrong with those figures....

Hi, I think this is very much negotiable from what I do know. If you allow them scope to earn, like offer privates etc, its nowhere near this. Certainly a few have done it basically at cost to assist WCS growth here, Robert & Deborah for sure, Jordan & Tatiana, Parker & Jessica in the past. .
They all have such huge enthusiasm that is beyond the mighty $$$.
If popularity grows this may well change but that is the nature of things...

[ducasi]

I'm not especially interested in how "big" the name is, just on how good the teaching and dancing is. I also think seeing different faces on the stage from the folks you saw at the last half-dozen weekenders is a good thing – hopefully teaching different things, or differently.

So, I quite like seeing "imported" teachers, just so long as we're getting our money's worth.

[drathzel]

Originally Posted by FoxyFunkster

i can see your point.....but not having been taught or seen Parker and Jessica before i have to say they were amazing....even just to watch their showcases live was awesome....

I know they are but they are only benefiting the "coasters" People like Paul F can coast and ceroc so not only are they teaching wcs to MJ people they can get up and dance with absolutely everyone not just the dance they are teaching!

[FoxyFunkster]

Originally Posted by drathzel

I know they are but they are only benefiting the "coasters" People like Paul F can coast and ceroc so not only are they teaching wcs to MJ people they can get up and dance with absolutely everyone not just the dance they are teaching!

In fairness, All the big names like Vincent and Flavia, Parker and Yuval as in Yuval and Nathalie were jiving with the punters..obviously they were in demand to dance their own dance style but it`s more to do with effort and putting yourself out there as a teacher IMHO than the style you choose to dance in....and also like i said the quality of their Showcases were of the highest order......how about PaulF, simon and nicole and J&T all at the same weekender............

[Caro]

Frankly with the choice of weekenders currently on the market, big names (obviously especially WCS AFAIC) do make a difference for me. It's quite simple actually, I don't think I'd go to a weekender if there wasn't any.

In a weekender I am looking for inspiration (i.e. something extra that I don't get at my regular venue), and they never fail to bring it to me... whether it is truly awesome cabarets, classes (workshops or privates), or social dancing...

Ceroc have got some very good teachers too but I have to say that in Scotland we are lucky enough to have Frank to bring them up to us (at the beach ballroom in aberdeen) very regularly, so I wouldn't feel the need to book a weekender especially if they were there. Whereas I'm quite happy to say that I am literally stalking the US WCS pros whenever they come to the UK or France.

[TheTramp]

Originally Posted by Caro

Ceroc have got some very good teachers too

How would you know? When was the last time you made it to a class??

[Caro]

Originally Posted by TheTramp

How would you know? When was the last time you made it to a class??

Since I started dancing, I don't think I have ever been in Aberdeen and missed a single workshop at the beach ballroom week-ends...

Plus, there's one teacher at one of the venues I attend that I would hardly consider 'Ceroc' as he teaches WCS moves...

[Miguel]

Originally Posted by FoxyFunkster

.......any thoughts anyone????

Cabaret, competitions, Jive Aces, fancy dress, MC's etc. are all a complete and utter waste of time. Unnecessary interruptions to a good evening. Why have them when there are so many great dj's around?

[Sheepman]

I don't think FoxyFunsters arithmetic quite works, don't forget there a lots of other costs that go with those extra punters coming throught the door, presumably the accommodation being the biggest one.

My guesstimate would be that it makes a difference to a maximum of 10% of the total crowd, so the CBA analysis is still on the plus side, (if the cost is £5000.)

Personally, it does makes a difference. As these are people that I want to be taught and inspired by, and learn from their example. Their performances do also make the cabarets a "must see."

The thing is, the bar has now been raised to this standard, the Southport weekenders have a standard to keep up to, it's hard to see these events lowering their standards. And the 10% of customers booking because of the stars are probably those that feel they have less to learn from the other teachers, because they have seen them so often, and they've achieved a high standard of dancing themselves. The fact that there is a large pool of good dancers at these events is in itself an attraction to others.

I think another advantage of doing this is that a mini course of lessons in a particular style can be taught through the weekend, allowing some rapid progression for some, and attract others that otherwise wouldn't attend lessons. Of course this can also be done by our regular teachers, but doesn't have the same appeal to me.

It's not just a case of how good the teaching is, there is also the novelty factor. For example, I think that Amir is one of the best teachers around, but I wouldn't especially pay to see him at a weekender, as I can get lessons with him every week. I'd certainly be there to see him doing a cabaret spot though.

Having just had a brilliant wekend at Camber, without doing a single lesson, (where there were excellent teachers that have inspired me over the years.) I can see that both types of weekender could successfully exist. There are plenty of other factors affecting my decision to attend.

Greg

[johnah]

Originally Posted by Keith J

Hi, I think this is very much negotiable from what I do know. If you allow them scope to earn, like offer privates etc, its nowhere near this. Certainly a few have done it basically at cost to assist WCS growth here, Robert & Deborah for sure, Jordan & Tatiana, Parker & Jessica in the past. .
They all have such huge enthusiasm that is beyond the mighty $$$.
If popularity grows this may well change but that is the nature of things...

I don't know where you get your info from Keith but it's way off the mark and certainly not beyond the mighty $$$

[Jamie]

For me, I can't wait for Southport this June, Jordan & Tatiana are my favourite WCS dancers, I'm quite happy to pay my £100 to dance with Tatiana! I wouldn't like to pay £100 to goto a weekender with no major teachers.