Salsa question

[David Bailey]

(Non-salseros, feel free to turn off now)

So, I'm at my local salsa place last night, chatting to the boss lady, mainly whingeing about "this fast music people play nowadays", and she's telling me that, not only is Cuban style back, it's now called Retro Cuban, and danced even faster.

I then think "What??? I've spent 6 months trying to persuade myself that this New Yorker style really doesn't look dumb, and I've nearly got the hang of it - and now they've changed the rules? Again?"

Can anyone confirm / deny this Retro Cuban thing? Also, that whole name makes me feel very old...

I know, this is a Ceroc forum, but you guys know everything... Any comments?

[under par]

Originally Posted by DavidJames

(Non-salseros, feel free to turn off now)

So, I'm at my local salsa place last night, chatting to the boss lady, mainly whingeing about "this fast music people play nowadays", and she's telling me that, not only is Cuban style back, it's now called Retro Cuban, and danced even faster.

I then think "What??? I've spent 6 months trying to persuade myself that this New Yorker style really doesn't look dumb, and I've nearly got the hang of it - and now they've changed the rules? Again?"

Can anyone confirm / deny this Retro Cuban thing? Also, that whole name makes me feel very old...

I know, this is a Ceroc forum, but you guys know everything... Any comments?

Turn coat go and find yourself a salsa forum....go on.....now!

I really don't know the answer can you tell!

[David Bailey]

Originally Posted by under par

Turn coat go and find yourself a salsa forum....go on.....now!

Oh, I did (www.salsamafia.com of course), but they're a bit bitchy over there, and I couldn't find an answer in the archives, crap search function...

There was a nice set of posts about West Coast Swing though...

[Andreas]

Not sure about 'Retro Cuban' but I did notice that over the past two months Salsa music got faster again. Sad thing really is that hardly anybody actually can dance to it. All that it means is that people are more often than not off beat.

My opinion on this whole thing is that people have too much trouble dancing to 'slow' music, hence they choose fast tracks. Another reason is the 'show factor'. They don't feel the music and simply focus on showing difficult moves to fast music. Do one dance, sit two out, do another one .... silly really. Perhaps also the bars have requested faster music to sell more drinks.

[JoC]

I had a look at a salsa forum too (different one), and it just wasn't the same, made us lot look like a bunch of softies (I'd rather stay among the softies).

Also heard Cuban mentioned a few times at my one and only salsa night last week, apparently the DJ was indeed playing a lot of cuban music, and the nearest and apparently only classes near to me are Cuban too. (Didn't hear retro mentioned but I probably wouldn't have been worth explaining the details to.)

So what is salsa if it's not Cuban?

[Anna]

Cuban is just one of the ways or styles you can dance Salsa..

kind of like.. okay a really bad example relating to MJ would be..

You can dance MJ so it looks latin... or so it looks bluesy... or so it looks rock n roll.. but no matter what style you give it, its still MJ.

The Cuban thing is a bit like that.. its just another way to dance Salsa. (that i assume orginated from Cuba?)

You can dance Salsa with a LA, NY, Cuban, Retro-Cuban, or Millennium flavour (to name a few).. Or you can mix a combo of all of them It's a bit like a buffet..

- Anna, Wannabe Super Salsera

[El Salsero Gringo]

Originally Posted by JoC

I had a look at a salsa forum too (different one), and it just wasn't the same, made us lot look like a bunch of softies (I'd rather stay among the softies).

Also heard Cuban mentioned a few times at my one and only salsa night last week, apparently the DJ was indeed playing a lot of cuban music, and the nearest and apparently only classes near to me are Cuban too. (Didn't hear retro mentioned but I probably wouldn't have been worth explaining the details to.)

So what is salsa if it's not Cuban?

My one line answer to that question is that Cuban Salsa goes round-and-round; New York/LA style teaches the cross-body lead in pretty much the first lesson, and you go backwards and forwards instead. It's less wiggly in the arms too, from what I've seen. But I'd love to hear a more detailed disambiguation between the styles from a Salsero who knows.

[Anna]

Where's Andreas when you actually need him?!

Well.. NY Salsa is danced on 2.. LA Salsa is predominantly danced on 1.. but on 2 is becoming more popular.. Cuban is danced on 1.. LA is a lot flashier than Cuban.. ermmm anything else I can think of.. not at the moment no

[El Salsero Gringo]

Originally Posted by Anna

Where's Andreas when you actually need him?!

Well.. NY Salsa is danced on 2.. LA Salsa is predominantly danced on 1.. but on 2 is becoming more popular.. Cuban is danced on 1.. LA is a lot flashier than Cuban.. ermmm anything else I can think of.. not at the moment no

I've been to loads of salsa classes in the UK calling themselves NY and none of them teach on the 2!

...although I suppose it's possible that what's called NY style here isn't what's called NY style in NY, for instance.

Where *is* Andreas when you need him?

[Anna]

REALLY..

but thats like.. the one main thing that makes NY different from the others.. weird..

they're probably just teaching you LA with some NY styling - I suggest you sue them

[JoC]

Originally Posted by Anna

Well.. NY Salsa is danced on 2.. LA Salsa is predominantly danced on 1.. but on 2 is becoming more popular.. Cuban is danced on 1.. LA is a lot flashier than Cuban.. ermmm anything else I can think of.. not at the moment no

total beginner ladies don't need to worry about this sort of thing, right???

[David Bailey]

Originally Posted by Anna

but thats like.. the one main thing that makes NY different from the others.. weird..

Well, from what little I know, over in the UK we have:
- Cuban: "spinny style" basically
- "New-York" - Cross-body style
- "On 2" style (break on 2)
- Columbian style: lots of footwork and twists with arm tension

(I appreciate names may vary!)

90%+ of classes in London are cross-body style, I believe.

But in the happening* clubs, as Andreas say, they're playing very fast music, which you can really only do Cuban to. I was just getting the hand of cross-body style as well. Bloody salsa and it's fashions

Originally Posted by JoC

total beginner ladies don't need to worry about this sort of thing, right???

Nah, it's just different salsa styles - unless you're being taught "On 2", which is slightly different to the others.

The other trouble is that most salsa dancers are massively inflexible, and massively unaware of this "musicality" and "interpretation" stuff.

Hmmm, maybe I should bitch about this on a salsa forum somewhere. After all, this forum doesn't take up much of my time...

* Bear in mind that I know nothing of these happening clubs of which people speak, but that's what I'm told

[Mr Cool]

Originally Posted by Andreas

Not sure about 'Retro Cuban' but I did notice that over the past two months Salsa music got faster again. Sad thing really is that hardly anybody actually can dance to it. All that it means is that people are more often than not off beat.

My opinion on this whole thing is that people have too much trouble dancing to 'slow' music, hence they choose fast tracks. Another reason is the 'show factor'. They don't feel the music and simply focus on showing difficult moves to fast music. Do one dance, sit two out, do another one .... silly really. Perhaps also the bars have requested faster music to sell more drinks.

I agree almost nobody dances salsa to the music I fail to understand why they all seem to want to chase the music when if they danced to slightly slower latin music. It could be so good. Such a pity as there is so much good latin music to choose from.

[Lynn]

Originally Posted by DavidJames

Well, from what little I know, over in the UK we have:
- Cuban: "spinny style" basically
- "New-York" - Cross-body style
- "On 2" style (break on 2)
- Columbian style: lots of footwork and twists with arm tension

I would think of it in terms of the cuban going round while cross body is danced in a slot.

I think of cross body style as LA, it sounds like its called NY style over there. In NY it is cross body style but I heard it is danced on 2. Based on hearing a teacher (Susanna Montero) say that when she went to salsa clubs in NY everyone was dancing on 2 - no-one would dance with her on 1. She quickly learnt on 2!

Here both Cuban and cross body are taught and the keen dancers tend to go to more than one class per week which means they do both and tend to mix and match!

[Night Owl]

All sounds very technical
I`ve just spent the last year in salsa (cuban)classes being told to keep my legs straight and was almost there


now in ceroc i`m told to keep my legs bent lol can`t win
enjoying it tho

[Anna]

these "Salsa" teachers should be shot!!

Since when did you ever dance Salsa with straight legs?!?!?!?!?!

- Anna, The Grim Reaper

[Night Owl]

and this teacher is cuban lol

her theory being she could dance all night

where as i with my bend legs would only last a few hours

also with leg straight and wieght on it its resting i suppose
where as me and my bent knees are carrying the weight all the time

and any way what do i know
i`m only a beginner really

[Anna]

But if you have straight legs you might as well be doing Mambo because the style straight leg dancing is going to give you isn't Salsa, its Ballroom Latin.. (Straight legs changeds the hip action and also restricts the movement that the rest of your body can be doing at the same time)...

Tell her to to watch out.. Anna's coming for her



- Anna, Princess of Darkness

[Night Owl]

I`ll take your word for that Anna

I`ll tell her if I see her again

Gonna concentrate on ceroc for now tho

New class starts soon 1st sept

so no straight legs for a while lol

[frodo]

Originally Posted by Anna

But if you have straight legs you might as well be doing Mambo because the style straight leg dancing is going to give you isn't Salsa, its Ballroom Latin ...[/size]

Aside from perhaps a timing difference though.