Are West Coast Swing advocates the most annoying people in dance?

[Get a grip]

Are West Coast Swing advocates the most annoying people in dance?

Being relatively new to 'modern' partner dance and the whole forum concept I thought it important to give an overview of how new members perceive the scene (I thought this would also be the best way of making lots of new friends...)

My background is in Ballroom and Latin, so believe me I know about pompous, self serving, egotistical twats. However, given the level of talent that is required to compete at a high level and the level of commitment required from beginners, it's not difficult to understand why ballroom dancers consider themselves to be above the rest of us. It is, after all 'proper dancing'...

Being then introduced into the UK modern dance scene I can't believe the level of pomposity displayed by people of so little talent. You have the whole swing/lindy thing V's Ceroc and modern jive where the swingers consider themselves to be the cats flaps and who seem hell bent on railing against Ceroc and what it stands for - and then on the other hand you have the Cerocers themselves who mostly just seem to want to dance and are amazed that they can do it (well almost... what is that walking 'limp' thing they do all about and the kangaroo arms??)

It's all very odd... I don't pretend to know all the in's and out's of the history, but isn't Ceroc the main reason why most people got into dance in the first place? Nigel, Victor etc. etc? My understanding is that Ceroc started the trend for modern partner dancing, trained loads of teachers up who then promptly stuck two fingers up at the whole shebang and went to do their own thing. Now, that's fine, such is human nature - but don't then whinge about it and don't forget that you wouldn't have a livelihood if James Croney didn't have the guts and the foresight to set it all up in the first place - Get A Grip....

As for West Coast Swing, well....

I started very briefly, about a year ago and have just started back in the last few weeks - and I have never come across such a bunch of snooty wannabes. Yes, it is a beautiful dance style and it is expressive and complex, but there is no real format to the teaching - the teachers themselves are great dancers but there is more to it than that. I'll give you an example... Lets name and shame Paul Warden, shall we? (Cat's actually pretty good) Paul has this air of being above everyone, but where as there is no doubt he is a great dancer, he is also a shockingly bad teacher (unless he's explaining the woman's part for some reason...) He seems to forget that beginners find it difficult and races on at breakneck speed with the clarity of an over processed pea soup. Not only that, he has to be the most unprofessional teacher on the circuit, always turning up late for classes and always unprepared - is that really acceptable behaviour?

So that's not a good start - and then you have the dancers themselves. From what I can see a lot of them are people who simply can't dance very well and have latched onto WCS as some kind of saviour. So here's a news flash... if you were an average Ceroc dancer you are going to be a below average WCSger. The fact that you can copy the foot patterns DOESN'T mean that you can dance! I've seen some shocking male dancers who think they are great but who are cringingly embarrassing to watch (ladies you actually come out of it with grace and elegance...)

Now all of this is fine, because everyone has to learn - but GET A GRIP, just lose the attitude please. You are no better than anyone else and I would much rather watch an average Ceroc dancer than some twat poncing around thinking that he's God's gift. Just remember, the fact that you wear high heels doesn't give you the right to look down on everyone else.

So there...

[Gus]

Hmmmmm .... popcorn anyone? This should be a good show. Looks like Get a Grip is after Fletch's title of "Arriving with the Biggest Bang on the Forum".

[Lou]

Originally Posted by Get a grip

(I thought this would also be the best way of making lots of new friends...)

Best. First. Post. Ever.

[jacksondonut]

Hiya..

just a quick response really... you do have a right to your opinion, but as a Ceroc person of many years, just discovering WCS and a veritable rank beginner..all I have experienced, is a lovely warm bunch of people who try hard to help you. Really try... if anything, because it is that much harder to pick up... I get a lot of pleasure out of trying... and I believe that they genuinely want to teach.. especially the people you have named... they go out of their way to 'help' people like me and I havent come across any of the attituded you mention.. thats why I keep going back.. despite the distance I have to travel..

Be fair, maybe it's just your perception... give it a fair go and meet some of these people.. be open minded and you will find that in whatever dance scene you are involved in, there will be an element of 'pomposity' etc.,

good luck

[Feelingpink]

So perhaps you could share why you are learning WCS if you seem to hold the teachers and your fellow dancers in such low esteem? It doesn't sound as if it is much fun for you.

[Gus]

Originally Posted by Lou

Best. First. Post. Ever.

Hmmmmm ... just wait till he turns his wrath on those REALLY arrogant LeRocers (CeRoc wannabees) who keep on bleating on about what foot to step back on ......

[Get a grip]

Ms Donut...

For someone like yourself it's no problem because you see the good in everyone - but Im a twisted cynic and I'm more difficult to please...

[Lou]

Originally Posted by Gus

Hmmmmm ... just wait till he turns his wrath on those REALLY arrogant LeRocers (CeRoc wannabees) who keep on bleating on about what foot to step back on ......

Yeah, but anyone who says

Originally Posted by Get a grip

.....James Croney...

will always make me chuckle.

(BTW... are you sure he's a he? )

[Feelingpink]

Originally Posted by Get a grip

Ms Donut...

For someone like yourself it's no problem because you see the good in everyone - but Im a twisted cynic and I'm more difficult to please...

You don't say...

[Get a grip]

It was a bad experience first time around but I believe in giving everyone and everything a second chance... except homosexuality, don't want to do that again...

[Get a grip]

They don't have feet, they have hooves....

[David Bailey]

Originally Posted by Get a grip

Are West Coast Swing advocates the most annoying people in dance?

Err... yes? No? Maybe? Sometimes? Oh, the pressure of making decisions...

Originally Posted by Get a grip

(I thought this would also be the best way of making lots of new friends...)

Originally Posted by Get a grip

However, given the level of talent that is required to compete at a high level and the level of commitment required from beginners, it's not difficult to understand why ballroom dancers consider themselves to be above the rest of us. It is, after all 'proper dancing'...

Nope - Ballroom dancing is what you do if you can't handle Argentinian Tango yet.

Originally Posted by Get a grip

isn't Ceroc the main reason why most people got into dance in the first place?
...
My understanding is that Ceroc started the trend for modern partner dancing, trained loads of teachers up who then promptly stuck two fingers up at the whole shebang and went to do their own thing.

I suspect your understanding is, probably, not correct - or at least a massive simplification.

But MJ in general, and Ceroc in particular, can definitely make a claim to keeping the flame of partner dancing flickering throughout the Dark Years of the 1980s for a large part of the UK population, yes.

Originally Posted by Get a grip

don't forget that you wouldn't have a livelihood if James Croney didn't have the guts and the foresight to set it all up in the first place

Yep. Good old Croney.

(I'm opening a book on whether GAG will last longer than Tangomoon, place your bets please...)

[Get a grip]

Sorry, just getting the hang of this... that should have read 'LeRocers don't have feet' they have hooves, because clearly lots of things have hooves and to drop that in there in abstract could be confusing..

[robd]

Originally Posted by Get a grip

I'll give you an example... Lets name and shame Paul Warden, shall we?

So what did Paul say when you pointed out all the problems you saw in his teaching style to him? You did point them out to him, didn't you? You haven't just made a point of naming and shaming someone who's not on the forum to defend themself whilst posting anonymously have you?

Good read though.

[Cruella]

Very entertaining so far. Although the use of the word snooty does ring some bells!

Originally Posted by Get a Grip

I started very briefly, about a year ago and have just started back in the last few weeks - and I have never come across such a bunch of snooty wannabes.

[Feelingpink]

Originally Posted by Get a grip

It was a bad experience first time around but I believe in giving everyone and everything a second chance... except homosexuality, don't want to do that again...

So what did you think of morris dancing?

[WittyBird]

Originally Posted by Get a grip

except homosexuality, don't want to do that again...

How about for your next post you stick in a racist comment or 2 and I think you've pretty much covered everything

[Get a grip]

Originally Posted by robd

So what did Paul say when you pointed out all the problems you saw in his teaching style to him? You did point them out to him, didn't you? You haven't just made a point of naming and shaming someone who's not on the forum to defend themself whilst posting anonymously have you?

Good read though.

Of course I have - that's what everyone does on the forum isn't it??? No one really addresses the issues face to face, it's all about subterfuge and entanglement..

[Get a grip]

Originally Posted by Feelingpink

So what did you think of morris dancing?

I've already said, I don't want to try homosexuality again..

[Lou]

Originally Posted by Get a grip

'LeRocers don't have feet' they have hooves, because ..

... we're clearly the spawn of Satan.

(Except Mr & Mrs Wiggle-Clevedonboy, of course).