Back injury

**Lynn** · 22nd-February-2007, 11:49 PM

I did look for a thread on this, but couldn't find one. I'm sure there is one somewhere!

Just wanted some advice. I hurt my back last night. I'm pretty sure it was as a result of some strange twisting in a basket where due to the hold I was being pulled off balance and twisted at the same time but couldn't step back. Anyway, that's not that important, what I want to ask is...

My back is sore at one side - would this match with a twisting injury?

Sometimes it aches, other times it feels like its all clenched up - anyone know why?

Any advice on how to treat it? I've tried painkillers, gentle stretching, Ibuprofen gel and a hot water bottle. Is heat good?

Any other advice or comments - I'm sure others have experienced this. Its at the level of causing me problems sleeping and impairing my concentration at work so I need to deal with it, plus I want to be fit for Storm next weekend!

Thanks. Gentle

welcomed.

**drathzel** · 23rd-February-2007, 12:04 AM

I hope it wasnt the repeated use of the basket parcel

I had a car accident when i was 17 and pulled all the muscles in my back (so i can sympathise) It was so bad the doctor gave me some really strong painkillers which made me hallucinate.

I dont advise that but i do advise hot baths/heat pads, lots of resting and relaxing and swimming (as the muscle can be exercised but supported by the water) helps. Dont let your muscles cool down too quickly after dancing/exercising. Pain killers are good but you dont want to take too many as you will ignore the pain and could do it worse damage.

hope this helps

**Lynn** · 23rd-February-2007, 12:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by drathzel

I hope it wasnt the repeated use of the basket parcel

No.

It was a beginner doing the basket, and not moving his feet, holding me in completely tight to his body so I couldn't step back as he was in the way, but he was still twisting me. Of course being a beginner he did it every 4th move, and each time I tried to think of a 'defensive dancing' method to protect myself but simply didn't have enough control over where I was going to do that.

Quote:

Originally Posted by drathzel

I dont advise that but i do advise hot baths/heat pads, lots of resting and relaxing and swimming (as the muscle can be exercised but supported by the water) helps.

Been using a hot water bottle, didn't think of a hot bath, will try that, ta. I think I'll bring my hot water bottle to work tomorrow.

Paulthetrainer · 23rd-February-2007, 01:45 AM

Fresh injuries should normally be treated with ice, not heat.

Heat INCREASES inflammation (blood flow) and will ultimately INCREASE healing time - ice reduces inflamation and has the opposite effect.

Ibuprofen is an anti-inflammatory, so that is good. Plus ice only for first 24-48 hours. Heat can be used later in the healing process but not right now. Not until Saturday morning.

Sounds like the injury was probably caused by the twisting - possibly combined with a slight lean back (if your feet didn't move you round as quick as the leader moved you), which may have made the spine hyper extend and go into spasm.

I reckon you'll be OK for Camber though, but you have to reduce the inflammation first.

Paul

**Lynn** · 23rd-February-2007, 09:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paulthetrainer

Fresh injuries should normally be treated with ice, not heat.

Heat INCREASES inflammation (blood flow) and will ultimately INCREASE healing time - ice reduces inflamation and has the opposite effect.

Ibuprofen is an anti-inflammatory, so that is good. Plus ice only for first 24-48 hours. Heat can be used later in the healing process but not right now. Not until Saturday morning.

I did wonder. I have no idea about when to use ice and when to use heat. So I shouldn't have my hot water bottle in work with me then? It might ease the pain a bit at the time, but makes it take longer to heal then?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paulthetrainer

Sounds like the injury was probably caused by the twisting - possibly combined with a slight lean back (if your feet didn't move you round as quick as the leader moved you), which may have made the spine hyper extend and go into spasm.

Twisting and lean back was exactly what was happening. My feet couldn't move at all as the leaders foot was in the way, and I was being pulled back and twisted at the same time. Amazing how a simple basket can cause an injury if done incorrectly. I'll have a quiet word with the guy next week and show him how to do it properly. (I won't tell him about my back though, as he would feel bad.)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paulthetrainer

I reckon you'll be OK for Camber though, but you have to reduce the inflammation first.

Good news. I probably shouldn't go to AT tonight, esp as we're doing ochos and giros, lots of twisting, but there are so many extra ladies, I won't be dancing much and I can sit out and watch for the majority of the time.

Appreciate your advice Paul, one more thing - is gentle stretching good or bad at this stage?

**Trouble** · 23rd-February-2007, 11:29 AM

sorry to hear about your back Lynn, there really is nothing worse is there.

When i damaged my back two years ago, i found that all the quick fix things didn't really work, it just took it away for a while and it becamse a re-occuring problem. what i did in the end was went to a physio and had it straightened and corrected, it worked and has not been a problem since.

a good tip for aching back is frozen peas inside a t towel put on the area on for as long as you can take it.

Hope it gets better soon.

xxx

Paulthetrainer · 23rd-February-2007, 11:30 AM

Hi Lynn yes gentle stretching is fine - just stretch to a point of 'mild discomfort'.

Also lay on your back on a hard floor with your knees to your chest and GENTLY rock your knees back and forth. This gives traction to the spine. Ideally get an accomplice to do the rocking part for you, that way you can focus on relaxing. Again, stay within the boundaries of pain.

When you get to Camber you might need choose your classes carefully, even if the back feels OK.

**Twirly** · 23rd-February-2007, 11:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paulthetrainer

Also lay on your back on a hard floor with your knees to your chest and GENTLY rock your knees back and forth. This gives traction to the spine. Ideally get an accomplice to do the rocking part for you, that way you can focus on relaxing. Again, stay within the boundaries of pain.

I'll vouch for that. I have had some form of back pain for about 15 years, though mostly it doesn't bother me much due to lots of osteopathy a few years back, and now I try and do my back exercises at least 4 days a week, this being one of them. (If I don't do the exercises, then the pain can come back.)

I usually do a circular motion though, in a clockwise direction. It gently massages the small of the back. I use a clockwise direction as it also massages the intestines, and that is the direction in which they flow.

Hope the back gets better soon Lynn

**Lynn** · 23rd-February-2007, 12:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trouble

When i damaged my back two years ago, i found that all the quick fix things didn't really work, it just took it away for a while and it becamse a re-occuring problem. what i did in the end was went to a physio and had it straightened and corrected, it worked and has not been a problem since.

Yep, I've had back injuries from riding falls in the past, and they've caused recurring problems. But this should be OK.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paulthetrainer

Hi Lynn yes gentle stretching is fine - just stretch to a point of 'mild discomfort'.

Also lay on your back on a hard floor with your knees to your chest and GENTLY rock your knees back and forth. This gives traction to the spine. Ideally get an accomplice to do the rocking part for you, that way you can focus on relaxing. Again, stay within the boundaries of pain.

Rock back and forth as in and out towards chest, or side to side?

Thanks for the advice.

LMC · 23rd-February-2007, 12:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paulthetrainer

Ideally get an accomplice to do the rocking part for you, that way you can focus on relaxing. Again, stay within the boundaries of pain.

Guess that's MY Thursday night accounted for then ...

Lynn, this sounds like the same exercise that Dizzy & I talked about/demonstrated if that helps?

Fingers crossed you feel less sore by Thursday

**Lynn** · 23rd-February-2007, 12:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LMC

Guess that's MY Thursday night accounted for then ...

Quote:

Originally Posted by LMC

Lynn, this sounds like the same exercise that Dizzy & I talked about/demonstrated if that helps?

I'm just not sure if I'm remembering it correctly, I did do one of the other ones.

Paulthetrainer · 23rd-February-2007, 12:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lynn

Yep, I've had back injuries from riding falls in the past, and they've caused recurring problems. But this should be OK.

Rock back and forth as in and out towards chest, or side to side?

Thanks for the advice.

Hard to say without knowing EXACTLY how much discomfort you're in. To be sure I'd say only backwards and forwards for now. After a few days graduate to the side to side/circular, but maybe no more than 1/2 inches from centre. (if that makes sense). You can stretch your glutes and hamstrings now though because that will almost certainly help too.

If it still hurts at Camber come find me. I'll be the one dancing.

Or track down Seriously Addicted, TurboTomato and even dare I say it, Woodface. They all know me.

Paul

**Freya** · 23rd-February-2007, 01:55 PM

Good Advice Paul. btw what do you do?

Ice is good for inflamation esp in the first 48hrs. It will promote healing! by speeding up the inflamation process. After the first 48 hrs Use of ice is normally pointless!

I would add that Personally I would still use heat with back injuries as there tends to be alot of spasm due to the nature of the muscles! It is hard to rest back muscles as they are constantly working to keep you up right! If there is a loit of swelling as well then I would avoid using it as paul said because it can increase the inflamation! Heat can help the muscles to relax preventing any further injury to the area by stretching an already tightened area! My advice would be to not have it too hot or have it in place for too long!

where abouts in your back is it? - I know it's to one side (coressponds with a twisting injury) but where abouts on that side! is it just off the spine, is it all the way round your side, is it over ribs, is it right down by your pelvis!

The other thing to look at is the ergonomics of your work position! Do you sit at a desk most of the day...etc etc!

**dave the scaffolder** · 23rd-February-2007, 02:05 PM

Lynn for gods sake go and see a professional no one on this forun knows what injury you have. If you do the wrong thing you may aggrevate your injury. FIND OUT WHAT YOU HAVE INJURED BEFORE YOU START TO TREAT THE INJURY. I have broken 23 bones in my body, every single one was a different recovery process, including 2 x spine fractures. What will work for one person may not work for another. All of this advice is good but you must find what is wrong with you first.

GO AND SEE A MEDICALY QUALIFIED PROFESSIONAL AND GET DIAGNOSED PROPELLY. XXX XXX

**David Bailey** · 23rd-February-2007, 02:30 PM

Lynn, I'd second (possibly with less caps) DTS's advice - if it's causing you trouble, see a professional physio (not a GP, in my experience they're rubbish).

Sports injury specialists - there's usually some at the posh gyms if you don't know of any personally.

**Trouble** · 23rd-February-2007, 02:52 PM

i think you DJ and DTS kind of stepped on my point there somehow.

I have just had two posts deleted as they were considered waffle. So waffle is also not allowed. Could somebody tell me what waffle is.?

**David Bailey** · 23rd-February-2007, 02:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trouble

i think you DJ and DTS kind of stepped on my point there somehow.

I have just had two posts deleted as they were considered waffle. So waffle is also not allowed. Could somebody tell me what waffle is.?

If it's a specific question, then waffle is off-topic stuff, not relevant to the topic.

As for further debates, please see Rule 2 as always.

**Lynn** · 23rd-February-2007, 03:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Freya

where abouts in your back is it? - I know it's to one side (coressponds with a twisting injury) but where abouts on that side! is it just off the spine, is it all the way round your side, is it over ribs, is it right down by your pelvis!

Mostly just below the ribs and round to the side, and in front a bit too, if that makes sense?

A few references to spasm - is that what's happening when it feels all 'clenched'?

No specific or sharp pain if I move in any certain way or anything like that.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Freya

The other thing to look at is the ergonomics of your work position! Do you sit at a desk most of the day...etc etc!

I do, but its a proper office chair and I've adjusted the back to give me a bit more support than usual.

Its not as bad as it was yesterday so hopefully its starting to feel better. If that doesn't continue, I will seek medical attention. My gym will probably be able to recommend someone. (The gym that I haven't been to for ages!)

Appreciate the advice and PMs.

**Freya** · 23rd-February-2007, 04:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lynn

Mostly just below the ribs and round to the side, and in front a bit too, if that makes sense?

yup sounds as if it's one of the abdominal muscles rather than one of the deep support muscles which is better!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lynn

A few references to spasm - is that what's happening when it feels all 'clenched'?

Could be but without actually looking at the area I can't be specific!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lynn

I do, but its a proper office chair and I've adjusted the back to give me a bit more support than usual.

thats good! make sure you don't slouch over either! it's all connected! keep your shoulders back and look straight forward. If you have to look down to see the computer screen try and adjust itso that it's pointing up or use a few heavy books to raise it so you can see it properly! the other thing to check out is that your all at right angles so your elbows are set at 90 degrees to reach the key board, your hips and knees are also bent at 90 degrees this'll stop any perching or increased bend at these joints, preventing prolonged abnormal curvature of the spine. I'm looking for a picture to make this make sense!

Basic sitting position

Picture

Hope this helps, this should be employed all the time and will help prevent back pain in the future.

As DJ and DTS said if it continues you should seek medical advice probably from a physio or sports injury clinic as opposed to a GP.

22nd-February-2007, 11:49 PM	#1 (permalink)
Lynn Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Belfast Posts: 7,881 Status: Loving housework - not! Rep Power: 6 Rep.: 2535	Back injury I did look for a thread on this, but couldn't find one. I'm sure there is one somewhere! Just wanted some advice. I hurt my back last night. I'm pretty sure it was as a result of some strange twisting in a basket where due to the hold I was being pulled off balance and twisted at the same time but couldn't step back. Anyway, that's not that important, what I want to ask is... My back is sore at one side - would this match with a twisting injury? Sometimes it aches, other times it feels like its all clenched up - anyone know why? Any advice on how to treat it? I've tried painkillers, gentle stretching, Ibuprofen gel and a hot water bottle. Is heat good? Any other advice or comments - I'm sure others have experienced this. Its at the level of causing me problems sleeping and impairing my concentration at work so I need to deal with it, plus I want to be fit for Storm next weekend! Thanks. Gentle welcomed.

23rd-February-2007, 12:04 AM	#2 (permalink)
drathzel Ceroc N.I. Franchise Owner Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Bangor, Northern Ireland Posts: 7,776 Status: Is happy and sleepy Rep Power: 5 Rep.: 1325	Re: Back injury I hope it wasnt the repeated use of the basket parcel I had a car accident when i was 17 and pulled all the muscles in my back (so i can sympathise) It was so bad the doctor gave me some really strong painkillers which made me hallucinate. I dont advise that but i do advise hot baths/heat pads, lots of resting and relaxing and swimming (as the muscle can be exercised but supported by the water) helps. Dont let your muscles cool down too quickly after dancing/exercising. Pain killers are good but you dont want to take too many as you will ignore the pain and could do it worse damage. hope this helps __________________ "A person's a person no matter how small" Horton hears a Who

23rd-February-2007, 01:45 AM	#4 (permalink)
Paulthetrainer Registered User Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Tonbridge, Kent, England, Europe, Earth, The Solar System, The Milky Way, The Universe. Posts: 181 Status: No Status Rep Power: 1 Rep.: 92	Re: Back injury Fresh injuries should normally be treated with ice, not heat. Heat INCREASES inflammation (blood flow) and will ultimately INCREASE healing time - ice reduces inflamation and has the opposite effect. Ibuprofen is an anti-inflammatory, so that is good. Plus ice only for first 24-48 hours. Heat can be used later in the healing process but not right now. Not until Saturday morning. Sounds like the injury was probably caused by the twisting - possibly combined with a slight lean back (if your feet didn't move you round as quick as the leader moved you), which may have made the spine hyper extend and go into spasm. I reckon you'll be OK for Camber though, but you have to reduce the inflammation first. Paul Last edited by Paulthetrainer; 23rd-February-2007 at 01:50 AM.

23rd-February-2007, 11:29 AM	#6 (permalink)
Trouble Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Waltham abbey Posts: 3,358 Status: horny Rep Power: 2 Rep.: 945	Re: Back injury sorry to hear about your back Lynn, there really is nothing worse is there. When i damaged my back two years ago, i found that all the quick fix things didn't really work, it just took it away for a while and it becamse a re-occuring problem. what i did in the end was went to a physio and had it straightened and corrected, it worked and has not been a problem since. a good tip for aching back is frozen peas inside a t towel put on the area on for as long as you can take it. Hope it gets better soon. xxx

23rd-February-2007, 11:30 AM	#7 (permalink)
Paulthetrainer Registered User Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Tonbridge, Kent, England, Europe, Earth, The Solar System, The Milky Way, The Universe. Posts: 181 Status: No Status Rep Power: 1 Rep.: 92	Re: Back injury Hi Lynn yes gentle stretching is fine - just stretch to a point of 'mild discomfort'. Also lay on your back on a hard floor with your knees to your chest and GENTLY rock your knees back and forth. This gives traction to the spine. Ideally get an accomplice to do the rocking part for you, that way you can focus on relaxing. Again, stay within the boundaries of pain. When you get to Camber you might need choose your classes carefully, even if the back feels OK.

23rd-February-2007, 01:55 PM	#13 (permalink)
Freya Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Up near the ceiling!!! Posts: 2,030 Status: No Status Rep Power: 2 Rep.: 781	Re: Back injury Good Advice Paul. btw what do you do? Ice is good for inflamation esp in the first 48hrs. It will promote healing! by speeding up the inflamation process. After the first 48 hrs Use of ice is normally pointless! I would add that Personally I would still use heat with back injuries as there tends to be alot of spasm due to the nature of the muscles! It is hard to rest back muscles as they are constantly working to keep you up right! If there is a loit of swelling as well then I would avoid using it as paul said because it can increase the inflamation! Heat can help the muscles to relax preventing any further injury to the area by stretching an already tightened area! My advice would be to not have it too hot or have it in place for too long! where abouts in your back is it? - I know it's to one side (coressponds with a twisting injury) but where abouts on that side! is it just off the spine, is it all the way round your side, is it over ribs, is it right down by your pelvis! The other thing to look at is the ergonomics of your work position! Do you sit at a desk most of the day...etc etc! __________________ Living in a confused state....Permantly!

23rd-February-2007, 02:05 PM	#14 (permalink)
dave the scaffolder Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Biggleswade. Posts: 1,738 Status: No Status Rep Power: 1 Rep.: 645	Re: Back injury Lynn for gods sake go and see a professional no one on this forun knows what injury you have. If you do the wrong thing you may aggrevate your injury. FIND OUT WHAT YOU HAVE INJURED BEFORE YOU START TO TREAT THE INJURY. I have broken 23 bones in my body, every single one was a different recovery process, including 2 x spine fractures. What will work for one person may not work for another. All of this advice is good but you must find what is wrong with you first. GO AND SEE A MEDICALY QUALIFIED PROFESSIONAL AND GET DIAGNOSED PROPELLY. XXX XXX Last edited by dave the scaffolder; 23rd-February-2007 at 02:06 PM. Reason: spellyng

23rd-February-2007, 02:30 PM	#15 (permalink)
David Bailey Formerly known as DavidJames Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Norf Lundin Posts: 14,249 Status: Yes Blog Entries: 1 Rep Power: 8 Rep.: 3830	Re: Back injury Lynn, I'd second (possibly with less caps) DTS's advice - if it's causing you trouble, see a professional physio (not a GP, in my experience they're rubbish). Sports injury specialists - there's usually some at the posh gyms if you don't know of any personally. __________________ Jivetango Godfather Inventor of the Masterclass Baboon-worrier extraordinaire

23rd-February-2007, 02:52 PM	#16 (permalink)
Trouble Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Waltham abbey Posts: 3,358 Status: horny Rep Power: 2 Rep.: 945	Re: Back injury i think you DJ and DTS kind of stepped on my point there somehow. I have just had two posts deleted as they were considered waffle. So waffle is also not allowed. Could somebody tell me what waffle is.?