Women 'not allowed' to lead at Ceroc?

**Feelingpink** · 18th-March-2008, 08:36 AM

A friend is learning Ceroc at ISH and Lounge (City/Moorgate) and last night said she was enjoying it but there were too many women. When asked if she had tried leading, she said women weren't allowed to. Is this really right? And if so, is this sexual discrimination? It seems a bit daft.

**Lory** · 18th-March-2008, 08:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Feelingpink

Is this really right?

Absolutely not!

I was at a launch of a new venue some months back and there were women over and Mike Ellard himself, asked me if i'd be a lead!

**Tiggerbabe** · 18th-March-2008, 08:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Feelingpink

When asked if she had tried leading, she said women weren't allowed to.

Maybe she heard the teacher say "the men lead and the ladies follow"

**martingold** · 18th-March-2008, 09:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Feelingpink

A friend is learning Ceroc at ISH and Lounge (City/Moorgate) and last night said she was enjoying it but there were too many women. When asked if she had tried leading, she said women weren't allowed to. Is this really right? And if so, is this sexual discrimination? It seems a bit daft.

That's ridiculous how about all the female taxis who most of the time dance the lead
i think tigerbabe is correct and she was told that the woman (when she is a follower) shouldnt back lead

**drathzel** · 18th-March-2008, 10:11 AM

Sometimes if two ladies turn up together they will often think they need to dance together one leading one following. When this happens they are often told "you dont need to lead, you can just join in the rotation" but depending on how the teacher says it it might be taken in the wrong way.

I actively discourage ladies from leading until they have been dancing about 6 months, but i would never say that no they cant lead if they want to and plenty of my ladies lead so they can see its definitely done.

Once at intermediate level, often encourage the women t lead in beginners as it helps them with their own personal dancing.

**Lou** · 18th-March-2008, 10:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by drathzel

Sometimes if two ladies turn up together they will often think they need to dance together one leading one following. When this happens they are often told "you dont need to lead, you can just join in the rotation" but depending on how the teacher says it it might be taken in the wrong way.

I agree - I suspect that's the most likely thing that's happened. After all, FP was saying that her friend is learning. And when you're a beginner, it's tricky enough to learn one role, let alone getting mixed up trying to learn both.

DundeeDancer · 18th-March-2008, 10:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lory

I was at a launch of a new venue some months back and there were women over and Mike Ellard himself, asked me if i'd be a lead!

Oh look at you! Name dropping away

Maybe the teacher said "Ladies shouldn't lead"...it takes someone strong and inconsiderate to yank a beginner all over the dance floor till they get it right

**Steven666** · 18th-March-2008, 10:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Feelingpink

A friend is learning Ceroc at ISH and Lounge (City/Moorgate) and last night said she was enjoying it but there were too many women. When asked if she had tried leading, she said women weren't allowed to. Is this really right? And if so, is this sexual discrimination? It seems a bit daft.

Oh dear.

Next men won't be allowed to follow...

**martingold** · 18th-March-2008, 10:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by drathzel

Sometimes if two ladies turn up together they will often think they need to dance together one leading one following. When this happens they are often told "you dont need to lead, you can just join in the rotation" but depending on how the teacher says it it might be taken in the wrong way.

I actively discourage ladies from leading until they have been dancing about 6 months, but i would never say that no they cant lead if they want to and plenty of my ladies lead so they can see its definitely done.

Once at intermediate level, often encourage the women t lead in beginners as it helps them with their own personal dancing.

I completely agree with this post and couldnt have said it better myself

Quote:

Originally Posted by DundeeDancer

Maybe the teacher said "Ladies shouldn't lead"...it takes someone strong and inconsiderate to yank a beginner all over the dance floor till they get it right

**dave the scaffolder** · 18th-March-2008, 11:39 AM

I quite often dance as a follower and there are literally dozens of ladies who lead me expertly, such as...

Trouble, Tor, Sarah White all of the female taxi dancers, to name but a few.

IMHO if a person can lead and follow...KUDOS to them.

DTS Dave XXX XXX

Rich · 18th-March-2008, 01:35 PM

Women lead? Why not? Go for it!

I regularly dance with a lady who leads (most recently last night in Basidon) and they are the some of the most enjoyable and memorable dances of the evening.

Though I prefer to lead, there are, in my view, loads of good reasons for a lady to lead if she wants to, these include:

She might enjoy it!....Isn't that's reason enough?

The chalenge, it's unfamiliar teritory and a lot harder than I thought.

It'll make me a better dancer.....well I hope!

It'll help improve my lead.

Trying to steel the lead back from each other can be fun and introduces a slightly competitive, mischevious aspect to a dance.

I find the comments that some times come after intersting.

I could go on and on but I won't, but a the risk of being controversial I'd say to all the blokes try it accaisionally, it's a hoot, and to any ladies..what's sauce for the goose!

FoxyFunkster · 18th-March-2008, 03:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Feelingpink

A friend is learning Ceroc at ISH and Lounge (City/Moorgate) and last night said she was enjoying it but there were too many women. When asked if she had tried leading, she said women weren't allowed to. Is this really right? And if so, is this sexual discrimination? It seems a bit daft.

Er i teach at ISH, and tonght as always when i see 18 ladies over, i always say 2 things...ladies pleeeeeeeeeeeease bring some men with you next week, failing that if any of you feel confident enough to lead then please do....at 02 where i teach we probably have 12 good female leaders......i now only dance with those 12 girls as a follow now!

**Feelingpink** · 18th-March-2008, 04:22 PM

Thanks so much for the reply and the PM FF ... will forward on your comments to my friend

Mini Mac · 19th-March-2008, 10:42 AM

hmph what a load of rubbish!

i know some great female leads who lead just as well as a man...sometimes better...

my favourite leads include Hayley, Trouble, DD+, Caz, Ruby, Drathzel and of course Zara

i would love to lead and i am trying to lol..

women keep it up

by the way Tor is one of the strongest women i have ever seen...when i saw her in the heats of Double Trouble in Britrock...well..wow!

**Steven666** · 19th-March-2008, 01:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mini Mac

Tor is one of the strongest women i have ever seen...when i saw her in the heats of Double Trouble in Britrock...well..wow!

Strength Vs Leading

I wasn't aware there was a connection between those two...

**Minnie M** · 19th-March-2008, 05:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by drathzel

..........I actively discourage ladies from leading until they have been dancing about 6 months, but i would never say that no they cant lead if they want to and plenty of my ladies lead so they can see its definitely done.

Once at intermediate level, often encourage the women t lead in beginners as it helps them with their own personal dancing.

Nothing wrong with ladies leading, but they should be able to follow well first

**fletch** · 19th-March-2008, 05:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dave the scaffolder

I quite often dance as a follower and there are literally dozens of ladies who lead me expertly, such as...

Trouble, Tor, Sarah White all of the female taxi dancers, to name but a few.

IMHO if a person can lead and follow...KUDOS to them.

DTS Dave XXX XXX

I think you will find Tor had to be strong and say I WANT to lead when she 1st started, good job she's strong

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mini Mac

by the way Tor is one of the strongest women i have ever seen...when i saw her in the heats of Double Trouble in Britrock...well..wow!

aint thet the truth.

Tor is proberbly the stronges female lead I have ever known, but then she didn't start following till much later in her dancing.

**dep** · 19th-March-2008, 06:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Minnie M

Nothing wrong with ladies leading, but they should be able to follow well first

Does the corollary follow?
Do Leaders have to be accomplished before they start learning how to follow?

Mini Mac · 19th-March-2008, 06:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steven666

Strength Vs Leading

I wasn't aware there was a connection between those two...

yes well STEVEN666 i meant both of them as in she is a strong leader so therefore there is a connection!

**Minnie M** · 19th-March-2008, 06:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dep

Does the corollary follow?
Do Leaders have to be accomplished before they start learning how to follow?

In classes - I think so.

If you are a male lead and want to learn to follow, it would help if you knew how to lead first, if you want to join the classes,

However, in freestyle you can do as you wish

Some females prefer to lead rather than follow, so it doesn't always follow

T'is only my opinion

Must say it does annoy me sometimes, when there are sooooooooooo many females and most of the men are dancing with each other

18th-March-2008, 08:36 AM	#1 (permalink)
Feelingpink Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Greenwich, UK Posts: 1,574 Rep Power: 3	Women 'not allowed' to lead at Ceroc? A friend is learning Ceroc at ISH and Lounge (City/Moorgate) and last night said she was enjoying it but there were too many women. When asked if she had tried leading, she said women weren't allowed to. Is this really right? And if so, is this sexual discrimination? It seems a bit daft. __________________ Better too much than not enough - Luis Rodriguez

18th-March-2008, 10:11 AM	#5 (permalink)
drathzel Ceroc N.I. Franchise Owner Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Bangor, Northern Ireland Posts: 7,766 Rep Power: 4	Re: Women 'not allowed' to lead at Ceroc? Sometimes if two ladies turn up together they will often think they need to dance together one leading one following. When this happens they are often told "you dont need to lead, you can just join in the rotation" but depending on how the teacher says it it might be taken in the wrong way. I actively discourage ladies from leading until they have been dancing about 6 months, but i would never say that no they cant lead if they want to and plenty of my ladies lead so they can see its definitely done. Once at intermediate level, often encourage the women t lead in beginners as it helps them with their own personal dancing. __________________ "A person's a person no matter how small" Horton hears a Who

18th-March-2008, 11:39 AM	#10 (permalink)
dave the scaffolder Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Biggleswade. Posts: 1,693 Rep Power: 1	Re: Women 'not allowed' to lead at Ceroc? I quite often dance as a follower and there are literally dozens of ladies who lead me expertly, such as... Trouble, Tor, Sarah White all of the female taxi dancers, to name but a few. IMHO if a person can lead and follow...KUDOS to them. DTS Dave XXX XXX __________________ Hello I am not David Bailey. He is taller, better looking and a much much better dancer than I.

18th-March-2008, 01:35 PM	#11 (permalink)
Rich Registered User Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Sunny Grays. Posts: 6 Rep Power: 0	Re: Women 'not allowed' to lead at Ceroc? Women lead? Why not? Go for it! I regularly dance with a lady who leads (most recently last night in Basidon) and they are the some of the most enjoyable and memorable dances of the evening. Though I prefer to lead, there are, in my view, loads of good reasons for a lady to lead if she wants to, these include: She might enjoy it!....Isn't that's reason enough? The chalenge, it's unfamiliar teritory and a lot harder than I thought. It'll make me a better dancer.....well I hope! It'll help improve my lead. Trying to steel the lead back from each other can be fun and introduces a slightly competitive, mischevious aspect to a dance. I find the comments that some times come after intersting. I could go on and on but I won't, but a the risk of being controversial I'd say to all the blokes try it accaisionally, it's a hoot, and to any ladies..what's sauce for the goose!

18th-March-2008, 04:22 PM	#13 (permalink)
Feelingpink Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Greenwich, UK Posts: 1,574 Rep Power: 3	Re: Women 'not allowed' to lead at Ceroc? Thanks so much for the reply and the PM FF ... will forward on your comments to my friend __________________ Better too much than not enough - Luis Rodriguez

19th-March-2008, 10:42 AM	#14 (permalink)
Mini Mac Registered User Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Letchworth Garden City Posts: 740 Rep Power: 1	Re: Women 'not allowed' to lead at Ceroc? hmph what a load of rubbish! i know some great female leads who lead just as well as a man...sometimes better... my favourite leads include Hayley, Trouble, DD+, Caz, Ruby, Drathzel and of course Zara i would love to lead and i am trying to lol.. women keep it up by the way Tor is one of the strongest women i have ever seen...when i saw her in the heats of Double Trouble in Britrock...well..wow!

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