Acting as Judge (voting expereince)

[stewart38]

Some people have mixed views on should the audience or the 'professionals' be allowed to vote at dance comps.

At the Walthemstow Jive event they asked the auidence to vote

For those who were not there there were 6 heats of generally 3 couples dancing in each heat, 2 tracks per heat. One fast one slow. Then 6 finalist who dance two tracks each on their own

It wasnt my first time of scoring but what I found interesting and this is my personal expereince..

Firstly respect to judges generally it isnt easy.

1. It was harder to remove bias aways from the scoring then I thought (I knew two of the couples) but I hope I did

2.Its a discipline to wait to the end of the two songs when you have made you mind up ealrier on who has 'won' that round maybe after only the first song. I did change my mind sometimes after watching couples dance the 2nd song which I think is good.

3. Its very hard if you think 3 couples are about the same as I did in one round. Wanted them to all dance again but you cant and you have to make your mind up

There were other observations but I think the idea is great.

The draw back is maybe the auidence will miss/ not notice the finer qualities of the dance and/or be more impressed with a one flamboyant move.

I think not if number of markers are high enough.

[Dreadful Scathe]

I think being a judge is a skill like anything else. If, like in Jivemasters, you have 4 criteria to vote for then you must adhere to this - a lot of people seem to find this difficult to do.

You need to not care if the couple you are judging are ex-psychotic girlfriends or your mum or your best mate dancing with your wife or the members of bleedin Westlife (gits).

You also need patience to wait to the end and write down your marks. (or possibly write them in pencil or on another piece of paper till you decide on the "final" marks)

You must also resist the temptation to alter the marks based on some other criteria after you've written them down i.e. "Oh i have it as a draw but really they were better!" Or "I'll give her more marks now cos she has fantastic...hair!"

Realise there is nothing difficult about couples being "about the same" you make your decision, if they are all equal, fine, other judges will disagree with you anyway.

If you are reading this and you find any of that difficult, then you're simply a poor judge - don't do it again, Ill willingly follow you to such competitions with a cattle prod to "remind you" that touching a voting form is forbidden ....anyway, just shout abuse* at the people taking part instead

* Oi Amir you suck....oh its not Amir, its Victor...oh hang on, my glasses were set to negative.

[stewart38]

Originally Posted by Dreadful Scathe

I think being a judge is a skill like anything else. If, like in Jivemasters, you have 4 criteria to vote for then you must adhere to this - a lot of people seem to find this difficult to do.

You need to not care if the couple you are judging are ex-psychotic girlfriends or your mum or your best mate dancing with your wife or the members of bleedin Westlife (gits).

You also need patience to wait to the end and write down your marks. (or possibly write them in pencil or on another piece of paper till you decide on the "final" marks)

You must also resist the temptation to alter the marks based on some other criteria after you've written them down i.e. "Oh i have it as a draw but really they were better!" Or "I'll give her more marks now cos she has fantastic...hair!"

Realise there is nothing difficult about couples being "about the same" you make your decision, if they are all equal, fine, other judges will disagree with you anyway.

If you are reading this and you find any of that difficult, then you're simply a poor judge - don't do it again, Ill willingly follow you to such competitions with a cattle prod to "remind you" that touching a voting form is forbidden ....anyway, just shout abuse* at the people taking part instead

* Oi Amir you suck....oh its not Amir, its Victor...oh hang on, my glasses were set to negative.

Interesting comments , how do you become a good judge then ? Practice or natural ability. Which would suggest we leave the auidence out ?

[Graham W]

..I judged my first DWAS on Friday in Bristol, one thing I noticed was how quick the track went when trying to asess all the couples..

G

[stewart38]

Originally Posted by Graham W

..I judged my first DWAS on Friday in Bristol, one thing I noticed was how quick the track went when trying to asess all the couples..

G

So what did you do ?

Go for gut feel ?

I assume it sometimes can be easier judging ten couples on the dance floor at the same time in the early stage DWAS as the standard of dancers will be so different against the later stages when the standard smooths out but you might only have 5 couples left

[Dreadful Scathe]

Originally Posted by stewart38

Interesting comments , how do you become a good judge then ? Practice or natural ability. Which would suggest we leave the auidence out ?

I would say that my points cover what would make a good judge - and some people can never be good at it without practice and some may be naturally good at it. Same as everything else in life then.

There's nothing wrong with getting the audience to vote as long as you realise that, given lots of criteria to vote on, they are generally going to ignore it and vote for "who they like the best".

Nothing like a good generalisation is there

[Magic Hans]

Originally Posted by stewart38

Firstly respect to judges generally it isnt easy.

For me, the most important aspect of a judge is to have elephant thick skin! Dancing can be so very personal that it is inevitable that others will disagree, some passionately. [It helps if competitors also have thick skins!]

Secondly to accept that (especially unconsious) bias is fairly inevitable. Ask a mother to be unbiased toward one of their children! [ok, extreme, but I fell it makes a point] I will always be biased towards styles that I like, dress sense that I appreciate, moves that I like or consider clever, appropriate. In order to be fair, I'd have to negatively bias any friends - maybe overly so - and it's a fine balance.

Thirdly to be (specifically) accountable. When, as a motorcycle instructor, I am assessing a trainee, I get a gut feeling as to how safe s/he will be. That's not good enough, even if that trainee asks for no feedback, I have to be prepared to give it. It also makes me more confident of my decision.

If the crowd and judges broadly agree (as they mostly seem to), then that accountability is not so important. However, were I the organiser of an event where a competition result were a surprise or a shock, then in order to retain credibility, I would certainly want to take responsibility, and explain the result; or apologise for any mistakes procedural or personal.

Danger of a public vote is that an outsider (out of towner) is almost guaranteed not to win. It's far easier to be biased and anonymous (unaccoutable) as a crowd member!

Please feel free is ignore or diss any of the above, and I am not and have not been a judge in any competition as far as my memory recalls!

Ian

[philsmove]

..I judged my first DWAS on Friday in Bristol, one thing I noticed was how quick the track went when trying to asess all the couples..

So what did you do ?

He taped me on the shoulder of course

[Magic Hans]

Originally Posted by philsmove

He taped me on the shoulder of course

Cellotape? Gaffer tape or insulation tape?

[ToeTrampler]

Originally Posted by Magic Hans

..

Cellotape? ...

That for repairing Cellos?