Consideration on the Dance floor

[DavidB]

Originally quoted by Basil Brush
Sweeping statement coming up:
Lindy Hop takes up a tad more dance space than modern jive, but lindy hoppers are relatively more considerate when they dance. Modern jivers don't look about, bump into you and the leaders especially can become quite aggressive on a busy floor.

Years ago Lindy Hoppers were considered quite dangerous by Modern Jivers. The problem mainly came from the kicks - the last thing a jiver would expect was someone kicking behind them.

I don't know if it was a conscious effort on behalf of the teachers, but Lindy Hoppers do seem to be a lot more considerate now.

I just wish the same could be said for Modern Jivers. They now have the reputation for being the rudest, most dangerous and most inconsiderate dancers around. It is obviously not everyone - it is only a small minority who do this. And some venues get so crowded that it is almost impossible not to bump into someone. But whatever the reason, Modern Jive has a reputation that needs to be improved.

David

(And this is the best forum, by a long way.)

[Basil Brush (Forum Plant)]

Re. kicks...

Lindy kicks should not be a hazard, but can be when done by beginners or ceroccers! It's either a downwards kick/push with your foot, or a controlled kick where you can ALWAYS see where you're kicking. Inexperienced swing dancers tend to kick behind without looking and their legs are a bit too high. Ceroc teaches a peculiar lindy kick now- very different to lindy kicks!!!!

[Gus]

Originally posted by DavidB

I just wish the same could be said for Modern Jivers. They now have the reputation for being the rudest, most dangerous and most inconsiderate dancers around
David

David ... HOW COULD YOU?? I try to stay away for a few months (gainly employed for a change) and when I look back there you making acidic comments about your fellow man ... SHAME on you ... not that ODA would ever be so contentious ....

Nahh ... no good , I have to join the Oracle in the fray...

forget kicks etc ... nothing can compare to the damage that can be metted out by the wild exuberance of the modern jiver doing a yo-yo or the 'out of control' woman showing her style by waving her arm wildly behing her to emphasise her moves, whilst gently decapitating passing dancers..... yup, a few more incidents locally to once more prove that there are a significant amounts of MORONS still let loose on dancefloors .... or (counter point) are organisers guilty of packing too many people onto dancefloors that are too small ..... worth another thread Franck?

[Dreadful Scathe]

Originally posted by the returning Gus
are organisers guilty of packing too many people onto dancefloors that are too small

You can only blame the organisers so far, after all they may have a lot of people and no bigger hall available - its up to the dancers to dance appropriately for the space available. Its the inconsiderate dancers that don't care whats happening around them, regardless of style.

[Dave Hancock]

Originally posted by Dreadful Scathe
its up to the dancers to dance appropriately for the space available. Its the inconsiderate dancers that don't care whats happening around them, regardless of style.

Totally agree with you on this DS, although as has been discussed on previous threads it is often the fact that inconsiderate dancers are often those with a bit of experience but little floorcraft knowledge and as often as not may be blissfully unaware that there still is inconsiderate

[Graham]

Originally posted by Dreadful Scathe
Its the inconsiderate dancers that don't care whats happening around them, regardless of style.

Whilst I concede that such people exist, I think you have to bear in mind that a significant proportion of CEROCers are either beginners or simply not very talented. They're not so much inconsiderate as ignorant - they are blissfully unaware of how they're using the space. Since the organisers must be aware of this phenomenon I believe that they must be held accountable for how many people they let in.

[Graham]

Originally posted by Dave Hancock
Totally agree with you on this DS, although as has been discussed on previous threads it is often the fact that inconsiderate dancers are often those with a bit of experience but little floorcraft knowledge and as often as not may be blissfully unaware that there still is inconsiderate

It is often the case that I often don't really understand you completely - often because your sentence structure is often questionable.

[TheTramp]

C'mon. He's an accountant. What do you expect??

As for stopping people coming in. I'm not so sure about that one. How would you feel if you turned up to your regular venue, to be told that it was full, and you couldn't come in.

We once drove for over 1.5 hours to go to a dance down in Minstead near Southampton. And when we got there, it was full, and they wouldn't let anyone else in (they'd reached the fire restrictions limit). Needless to say, we weren't very happy, and we haven't been back there since...

Steve

[LilyB]

Originally posted by TheTramp
... And when we got there.........they wouldn't let anyone else in ....

Steve

Maybe they didn't want anymore beginners???
Or they had more than enough washing up to do!!!!!!

LilyB

Sorry, Steve - couldn't resist that!

[Will]

P.S. Can I just say that I totally disassociate and disagree with Lily's previous post.

[Dance Demon]

One of the biggest problems I have encountered is due to the " stepping in and out" motion of Ceroc and other modern Jive styles. I've lost count of the No. of times I've had my ankles and achilles tendons stomped on by a ladies Cuban heel, or a guys beetlecrusher Agree with DS that you dance to suit the conditions. Ballroom dancers are a prime example of this. When the floor is crowded they take smaller steps, and don't do anything too flashy. Considering they move around the whole dance floor, avoiding others is probably more difficult. I think it's called "etiquette"

[Gadget]

Originally posted by Dance Demon
One of the biggest problems I have encountered is due to the " stepping in and out" motion of Ceroc and other modern Jive styles. ~snip~ I think it's called "etiquette"

Isn't spatial awareness taught at any workshops? {It's been that long since I've attended any :sorry:}

[horsey_dude]

I have noticed that where most of the people are reasonable good dancers this is less of an issue. People will move in and out of the space on the dance floor without connecting even when it is fairly packed. I am surprised that when it is busy I will see a couple just walk to the floor without even trying to find a space and just start dancing so that every one around them has to move......

[Jon]

What sometimes lacks in Ceroc is common sense. The teachers should not teach moves that require space to do them safely in when the venue is packed, save them for a quieter night because people will want to practice them.

Even at the Champs this year on the whole the freestyle was ok and the standard was high enough that there wasnt too much bumping into each other. With 1 exception where 1 couple were constantly doing drops on the main dance floor, and I got knocked on the head by the guy once, needless to say he got one hell of a glare back, just wish I was brave enough to tell him not to be so stupid.

[Gus]

Originally posted by Jon
and I got knocked on the head by the guy once, needless to say he got one hell of a glare back, just wish I was brave enough to tell him not to be so stupid.

How terribly British ... the unmitigated terror of the glare ... secong only to the "letter to the Times". We are TERRIBLE at addressing the issue of people who simply should not be allowed to soil the human gene pool, never mind be allowed on a dancefloor. I must that I have once 'lost the plot' and told an offending muppet what he was doing wrong and how he could rectify it ... though I'm fairly sure that the 'concise' way I explained things may have led the poor chap to feel offended .....

I'm sorry, but if there are muppets on the dancefloor then the wet haddock squad needs to be ressurected and vengance dished out...

yeah .... I HAVE had a lousy day at work ... can't you tell?

[DavidY]

Originally posted by Dance Demon
One of the biggest problems I have encountered is due to the " stepping in and out" motion of Ceroc and other modern Jive styles.

I wonder if the "stepping" motion in Ceroc may be part of the problem - particularly the 'step back' - and also because as a leader you can end up in the same place for some time. I wonder if some leaders end up facing the same way for a number of moves & so lose track of what's going on around and especially behind them. Then the next step back is onto someone else's foot... (I try reasonably hard not to do this myself, but do occasionally fail :sorry:sorry:sorry)

Ballroom dancers are a prime example of this. When the floor is crowded they take smaller steps, and don't do anything too flashy. Considering they move around the whole dance floor, avoiding others is probably more difficult.

From what I remember (dimly!!) of ballroom it may even be easier - there is the advantage that as a leader you're mostly going forwards & can see where you're going! Also all the turning round means you can see what's all around you.

How do other dance styles compare with Ceroc in these aspects?

David

[Gadget]

Originally posted by horsey_dude
I am surprised that when it is busy I will see a couple just walk to the floor without even trying to find a space and just start dancing so that every one around them has to move......

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