Is there too much West Coast Swing at Modern Jive Weekenders?

[DS87]

I have to agree with Caro here the current trend in music is towards the slower R&B style which happens to be just perfect for WCS
One of the great things about MJ is the versatility and its adaptability to most styles of music which is facilitated by the ease at which other dance styles can be incorporated into MJ.

There are some excellent MJ dancers out there and Andy mentioned a number of them but I don't think that it is coincidence that most of the best MJ dancers have added something from a different dance style into their MJ.

It does seem that WCS rooms fail at many weekenders and the only explanation that I can think of is that WCS dancers feel the same as MJ dancers when it comes to atmosphere and enjoy dancing with more people. If the number of WCS dancers that feel comfortable freestyling is low then they are less likely to hide away on their own at an event. Where there is a larger concentration of WCS dancers normally at events with the bigger named WCS stars from the USA then they can make their own atmosphere.

So is there too much WCS at MJ events? NO! but then I am a WCS dancer so I am biased just as Andy who is not a WCS dancer seems to be biased against WCS.

As event organisers are ultimately in it for the money I doubt that things will change for as long as the music and the dance remain popular. I can only hope that this is a long time

[Caro]

And, who was it who said "Unless you managed to find some way to infiltrate my brains" you will not know what I think?

:exasperated smiley: you'll never get me, will you ? When I wrote 'Andy McG thinks that there are plenty of MJ dancers etc' I was merely correcting your previous post where you stated your opinion as if it was the only and universal Truth, which you seem to do very often.

I'm giving up.

[David Bailey]

Aren't they? I thought they were....

They'll be there, we hope (recent events notwithstanding), but they've got second billing. And to make things worse, in my little flyer thingy, it only talks about Benji Arjay and Melissa for June 2008.

[David Bailey]

There may be plenty of people who want to do classes.

That doesn't mean there is plenty of people who want to freestyle it.

Hah - yes, heard that one before. Salsa, Tango / Jango, WCS - it's easy enough to do the classes, but you've got to be good to do the social dancing comfortably.

[hinksfield]

:exasperated smiley: you'll never get me, will you ? When I wrote 'Andy McG thinks that there are plenty of MJ dancers etc' I was merely correcting your previous post where you stated your opinion as if it was the only and universal Truth, which you seem to do very often.

I'm giving up.

Hi Caro, dont give up, cant get enough WCS i think alot of people are looking to wcs as a little more challenging than MJ just on the basis that there is footwork to go along with all the upper body movements,for me i totally adore it it is sexy,slinky and creates a much stronger dancing partnership than anything i have tried for a long while....anyone who has not tried it you dont know what you are missing ..

Caro if your dancing in Aberdeen thurs i would love to partner you for some wcs ..

[Caro]

Hi Caro, dont give up,

lol, if one thing is sure, it's that I'm nowhere near giving up WCS

I meant I'm giving on trying to discuss with Andy McG - my communication skills are not up to par

Caro if your dancing in Aberdeen thurs i would love to partner you for some wcs ..

now that's the best offer I've had in a long time , where were you hiding all this time ?
Thursday is AT day for me, any chance to see you on tuesday at peterculter ?

[Andy McGregor]

I meant I'm giving on trying to discuss with Andy McG - my communication skills are not up to par

I'm receiving Caro's message loud and clear. There's nothing wrong with her communication skills

[NZ Monkey]

Hah - yes, heard that one before. Salsa, Tango / Jango, WCS - it's easy enough to do the classes, but you've got to be good to do the social dancing comfortably.

That's the important distinction here I think.

Lot's of people want to learn WCS, but their only exposure to it is in monthly or weekender workshops. It can give you an appreciation of the dance, but nothing more unless it's backed up by regular practice.

Dancing socially is not only practice in itself, but it's hard to do without practice. The whole situation seems like a catch 22 to me now, yet somehow we manage

[frodo]

That's the important distinction here I think.

Lot's of people want to learn WCS, but their only exposure to it is in monthly or weekender workshops. It can give you an appreciation of the dance, but nothing more unless it's backed up by regular practice.

Dancing socially is not only practice in itself, but it's hard to do without practice. The whole situation seems like a catch 22 to me now, yet somehow we manage

Maybe it is primarily only couples that manage that situation, hence the insular reputation of the dance.

[Bluey]

And, on the subject of the Swing, Blues and WCS room, I was there, I'm not guessing. At 11.45pm on Sunday, normally the busiest night for the Swing & Blues room there were 4 couples - the DJ was briefed and stuck to the brief.

Briefed at what?

At that time of the night actual people coming into the room and then turning back out was minimal, the action was all happening in the main room. It had nothing to do with WCS in fact in that set only 2 bluesy wcs tracks were play in 90 mins! From 12.30pm more people entered room, more people stayed!

[Bluey]

I'd probably agree with you on one point Andy – I don't think there is a need for a separate WCS room when there is good WCS music being played in one of the main rooms. Maybe be better to use the small rooms for niche music like Tango, Latin or Fast Swing.

The actual idea was for djs to include I believe some WCS bluesy numbers and leave the Justin Timberlake type in the main wcs room, trouble is it seems some DJ dont realise tracks like Lovestone should not be played in a mix room. Dancers are slowly catching on what WCS is and giving them a taster is a great idea, not a full set which I believe I heard on DJ did in the lower room. Maybe thats the set Andy saw?

[Minnie M]

The actual idea was for djs to include I believe some WCS bluesy numbers and leave the Justin Timberlake type in the main wcs room, trouble is it seems some DJ dont realise tracks like Lovestone should not be played in a mix room. Dancers are slowly catching on what WCS is and giving them a taster is a great idea, not a full set which I believe I heard on DJ did in the lower room. Maybe thats the set Andy saw?

Calling all DJs ..................
Isn't the job of a good DJ to "READ" the floor

I thought they were given an agenda of what the organisers would like them to play - then they should follow their "DJ experience" and read the floor and adapt the music accordingly

In the old days (before Dedicated WCS room) at Southport I remember Dance Demon keeping the room full throughout the whole of his set, changing the tempo and style of the music accoringly it was FANTASTIC !!! I miss that sooooooooooooooo much (having all dancers in one area)

[Tiggerbabe]

trouble is it seems some DJ dont realise tracks like Lovestone should not be played in a mix room.

Count me in that lot then, at 122 bpm Lovestoned is a great MJ track, I play it at regular classses, where there's not a WCS dancer in sight, and it gets a great reaction, every time

[ducasi]

The actual idea was for djs to include I believe some WCS bluesy numbers and leave the Justin Timberlake type in the main wcs room, trouble is it seems some DJ dont realise tracks like Lovestone should not be played in a mix room. Dancers are slowly catching on what WCS is and giving them a taster is a great idea, not a full set which I believe I heard on DJ did in the lower room. Maybe thats the set Andy saw?

I think tracks like LoveStoned and other "Justin Timberlake type" stuff should be played in main rooms and even in "Chill" rooms. They are great songs to dance to. Can't get enough of it.

[Bluey]

Count me in that lot then, at 122 bpm Lovestoned is a great MJ track, I play it at regular classses, where there's not a WCS dancer in sight, and it gets a great reaction, every time

I love the track and perfect for MJ/WCS but when trying to keep a balance in a mix room (Blues/swing/wcs) the dj should, shouldnt they, lean on more bluey wcs number?

[Bluey]

I think tracks like LoveStoned and other "Justin Timberlake type" stuff should be played in main rooms and even in "Chill" rooms. They are great songs to dance to. Can't get enough of it.

HI the mix room IM referreing to is a room set aside for Blues & swing adding in suitable balanced WCS tracks. ON the other side in MJ hall, the dj should be able to find excellent wcs swing that MJers will love dancing too?

[sidney]

Some friends of mine went to a mj freestyle last sunday in Rugby, and when I ask how it went they all complained about the music being too slow for them to dance to and the girls of the group saying the men were not in beat with them. They said too much blues all night when they had expected a more general mix of music. The problem is Blues and wcs work better at weekenders where there is the extra rooms and the freestyles which cater for that style but the majority of mj dancers as yet do not do blues and wcs want to go to mj freestyles and dance to music with the right beat. I myself prefer blues as I can't stand the bland pop music, I love to learn wcs but as yet there is no local classes in my area the nearest is 30 miles away, so I do salsa to improve my footwork. I can see where my friends are coming from as they enjoy mj and now feel they are been pushed out with the wcs music been played more at these events.

[robd]

I love to learn wcs but as yet there is no local classes in my area the nearest is 30 miles away,

30 miles is local when considering how thinly WCS classes are spread across the country. Though I quite understand the affordability issue in terms of transport I would also say that if people don't make the effort to support them they will close and then the nearest class will then be even further away.

[sidney]

In terms of affordabilty it would work out too expensive if I have to travel on my own and also I work long hours and the classes are in the week apart from the workshops which once again your talking about
£30 plus petrol, where with my salsa it is £40 for eight lessons and it is local.
so no contest.

[Lazy Dave]

This is a very interesting topic and it's good to know your history because it very often comes around again... Any dancers who have been around a while might like to back me up on this one.

Back in the day, when Camber was the MJ equivalent to Mecca, when you had to get booked on well in advance to be sure of tickets, they had a 'Swing and Blues' Room which believe it or not played swing and blues music which was aimed at 'expressive' MJ dancers and lindy hoppers. Lindy seemed to be the 'buzz' dance then. However, recognising this follwing for Lindy hop and seeing a market place, other dance weekenders started springing up offering a more swinging experience for your swing dancers. Once a choice was offered the swing dancers exited on mass, hardly ever to be seen again on the MJ circuit. I believe this was a great shame as they brought colour and zap to any dance floor and if the DJ pitched the music about right, you could please the MJ dancers and the swingers.

Could the same thing happen again?
In general are 'Westies' happy to continue sharing a dance floor or will they fly once the inevitable smaller WCS weekenders start to spring up?

I don't envy the organisers who have to try staying one step ahead and trying to please so many different people who are at different stages of their personal dance journey. As for me, I agree with Minnie M, it's great to see a room buzzing with different styles and personalities, but for this to happen the DJ's have to be VERY on the ball and the dancers in the room have to be VERY tolerant of other styles.

It's all about BALANCE at the end of the day. Andy makes a valid point (in his usual pantomime dame fashion ) but the replies are equally valid, now maybe a little love will keep this room balanced, start with some faster love (about 120-130 stokes per minute) followed by some medium lovin' (110-115 spm) and then bring it down later with some slow lovin' (80-110spm). After that repeat and enjoy!

My work here is done