I need a moves toolbox, where can I get one?

[DundeeDancer]

A partner who can 'feel' the music and respond to it, and also respond to my following and allow for some 'play time'.

I love dancing with people who can really respond to and play with the music.
I get very bored with dancers who just go through move after move without listening to the nuances in the music at all.....

Yeah I want to be in that dance like that but how am I going to make it happen?

What I'm I going to need?

The first thing that pop's into my head is a toolbox of moves.

I've got a feeling my: Pretzel, In & Out, First Move variation, Wurlitzer and double Handed YoYo into Hallejuha just isn't going to create the space to be able to connect to the music?

How am I going to construct this moves toolbox?
Searching for years for gem moves in class?
Maybe a specialist workshop?

Does anyone know the names of these moves that they can interpret and really get into?

I watch a lot of experience dancers dancing moves I've not seen in class yet and they look easy enough to perform and they look like they are getting right into the music and really playing with it. Wish I had MOVES like that to play with.

I don't want to attempt to learn 100's of moves maybe 50 intermediate moves that I know and can perform well is what I guess as being an idea goal for me to gain over the next few years or so.

Either that I could just learn to follow put some lippy on and ask Franck for that perfect dance

DD.

[DavidY]

I've got a feeling my: Pretzel, In & Out, First Move variation, Wurlitzer and double Handed YoYo into Hallejuha just isn't going to create the space to be able to connect to the music?

The In and Out might be one of the most basic moves ever - but it's nice and short, so if musicality is your aim, it can be a handy move to fill some time so you can hit a musical break with your next move.
I still do them, anyway.

Thinking about it, the In and Out variation where you change places with your partner (not sure what it's called) probably takes up the same amount of time but is slightly less basic.

[Aurion]

The trouble with tool boxes is that no matter how many tools you put in them you always end up using a hammer...


Seriously though I think from where you are now the best way to go is to look at the moves you know well and see what kinds of variations you can come up with. As others have said, positioning of your own body and connection to your partner will transform your dancing so that's where you should be looking. Its easier to perfect a move you know well than to keep adding increasingly difficult combinations.


btw I'm going to have to invent a move called the "hammer" now...
neg rep to the first person that mentions mc...

[Gav]

You may be looking at this the wrong way DD.

I don't know about you, but most struggling learners (this was me too) don't really hear the music as they dance. You hear and react to the beat, but 8 times out of 10, you couldn't tell someone which track had just been on.
This is natural and it will continue until you truly relax and stop worrying about moves. You'll know know when it's happened because you'll suddenly hear the music. You'll instinctively know when a break, tempo change or other change is coming in the music (even when you've never heard the track before) and that's when you'll find you can react to the music.
By all means, learn lots of moves, but not at the expense of feeling the music.
Most, if not all, of the moves I use are variations of beginner moves. I don't know if it looks good or not, but I think I give my partners a nice dance and most of them ask me to dance, so it can't be that bad.
It annoys me sometimes that I can only remember 10 or so moves after 2 years, but I'd rather do a few moves well and react to the music, than know all the moves and ignore the music (there are enough people that do that already).

HTH.

[Gav]

The In and Out might be one of the most basic moves ever - but it's nice and short, so if musicality is your aim, it can be a handy move to fill some time so you can hit a musical break with your next move.
I still do them, anyway.

Me too .

Except, over time mine has become a push-pull thingy, without any of the circular arm motion. No-one tells me I'm doing an in-and-out wrong, so I guess I must be leading it well enough. I suppose it's not really a move at all, just a time-filling, breather thingy.

[geoff332]

The trouble with tool boxes is that no matter how many tools you put in them you always end up using a hammer...

If you can't fix it with a hammer, it's not really broken.

Less is more.

The best musicality workshop I've ever done we spent the first two hours doing three basic beginners moves. Everyone - lead and follow - loved the dancing because we were forced to actually dance instead of doing moves.

There are two ways to dance well to music. One is to choreograph a routine. The other is to listen to and respond to the music. Freestyle dances are the latter. This is a lot easier if you're not thinking too much about moves. This typically means using moves that you know so well you don't have to think about. It does not mean knowing more moves.

[Lynn]

Yeah I want to be in that dance like that but how am I going to make it happen?

What I'm I going to need?

The first thing that pop's into my head is a toolbox of moves.

As this is an observation from a follower, leads might disagree. But my suggestions would be

- don't worry about learning new moves, in fact take a while and just don't think about increasing the amount of moves you know at all. You can go back to adding moves after a while. But you don't need a lot of moves to lead an excellent dance.

- get to Franck's workshops on connection, lead and follow etc - basically any sort of technique classes Franck does. These will give you more material to improve your dancing in a few hours than lots of new moves.

- take notes, find some things to apply eg on connection. Work on that for a few weeks, then focus on something else for a few weeks.

- consider booking a private lesson to work on connection, leading etc.

- spend time watching other more experienced leads, look at how they are dancing in relation to the music. Don't worry too much about styling at this point, just the connection and use of music.

- get a range of music and spend time listening to it, eg when driving in the car. Start to think about things you hear that you could maybe do something interesting with.

- don't be afraid of making mistakes, missing breaks, trying something that doesn't work - all part of the process.

- don't get annoyed with yourself if for a while your dancing seems to get worse as you try to improve, that can happen.

[DundeeDancer]

Seriously though I think from where you are now the best way to go is to look at the moves you know well and see what kinds of variations you can come up with. As others have said, positioning of your own body and connection to your partner will transform your dancing so that's where you should be looking.

Thanks Aurion, it's kinda the direction I'm starting to follow.

For the Candyman track which seems very fast to me, I enjoy kinda doing a left handed in out type motion, you know just playing with the tension between me and my follower in time with the music.

I can do that over and over and be really enjoying the dance but worry my partner may be thinking, this guy knows zip moves, what a loser...then I think I'm enjoying myself so to hell with it

I think I'll also start to experiment with sways more, I find them really enjoyable and you can just relax sway in time to the music and if adventures like I see others doing you can put in funky little dance step shuffles in there to.
These little shuffles and stuff like that are what I would like to have in my tool box. But maybe wrongly I think there is only certain moves that you can build these things onto?


As for the hammer, well the first move always works wonders for me.

[Aurion]

Thanks Aurion, it's kinda the direction I'm starting to follow.

For the Candyman track which seems very fast to me, I enjoy kinda doing a left handed in out type motion, you know just playing with the tension between me and my follower in time with the music.

I can do that over and over and be really enjoying the dance but worry my partner may be thinking, this guy knows zip moves, what a loser...then I think I'm enjoying myself so to hell with it

You can mix this up by doing a few change of places, pass by the follows right side (travelling return) or pass by follows left side (name?). Essentially the same feel but your one move is now 3 or 4.

I think I'll also start to experiment with sways more, I find them really enjoyable and you can just relax sway in time to the music and if adventures like I see others doing you can put in funky little dance step shuffles in there to.
These little shuffles and stuff like that are what I would like to have in my tool box. But maybe wrongly I think there is only certain moves that you can build these things onto?


As for the hammer, well the first move always works wonders for me.

Loads of variations for the 1st move and if you like fast tracks then one of my favourites is to borrow the whip moves from WCS (normal, inside & outside, ask me the next time we meet, it's easier to show than explain ).

[Steven666]

I have worked out that I only know 2 right handed moves after nearly 4 years. People say I use loads but I don't. Of course I use variations but in reality I use very few moves. My left handed and double handed moves follow the same suit.

As for learning moves, do you learn as taught in lessons? I don't, or at least very rarely do. If possible I either make them up or mish-mash things together.

And knowing 100's of moves isn't going to get you anywhere if they are all done averagely. A handful of moves done well on the other hand...

[dep]

You'll instinctively know when a break, tempo change or other change is coming in the music

I don't agree.
I don't know what's coming and therefore can't plan for it.
I have attended musicality classes and even when concentrating on the same piece of repeated extract, I cannot see it until it hits me. By then it's too late.
For this reason I find it impossible to dance interpretively. Instead I have to listen for my partners connection and let her interpret/hyjack or whatever turns her on.
I do add in a few little variations to match the beat but not for the breaks/changes.

Am I unusual, or are there some others out there?

and don't all jump in and say I'm odd/weird/etc, I know that already.

[dep]

I suppose it's not really a move at all, just a time-filling, breather thingy.

I use the "in-out" as a relaxer for my Follower and a signal that something Special is about to start.

[Lee Bartholomew]

You watch some of the really good dancers. Take Jordan and Tatiana for example. If you watch their videos on youtube, they do the same moves in almost every video. Im guessing like the rest of us, they only know a few moves or just remember the ones they have just discovered.

It's not what moves you do, it's not even how well you do it. It's your attitude to doing the moves. The dance is not just about getting your partner to wrap this way or that by moving your arms. Use your head, feet, legs, body etc.

To many dancers only dance with their arms. This os only 10% of your body so your only having 10% of a dance.

Try listening to your fav songs and imagine how you would dance to it or how your fave dancer would. Also try getting to different venues. A change is as good as a break (or something)

[gebandemuishond]

To many dancers only dance with their arms. This os only 10% of your body so your only having 10% of a dance.

I'm not a fan of army dances. For a start I find the boots hard to move in ... Taxi for one please...

Dan

[Gav]

I don't agree.
I don't know what's coming and therefore can't plan for it.
I have attended musicality classes and even when concentrating on the same piece of repeated extract, I cannot see it until it hits me. By then it's too late.
For this reason I find it impossible to dance interpretively. Instead I have to listen for my partners connection and let her interpret/hyjack or whatever turns her on.
I do add in a few little variations to match the beat but not for the breaks/changes.

Am I unusual, or are there some others out there?

It could be that you haven't reached that point or never will? I'm still learning and I still miss it more often than not.

However, there are 2 ways of achieving musicality (maybe more?):

1. Instinctively (as I do, you just feel the changes coming)
2. Counting.

Music follows patterns and by counting the beats and recognising the patterns you can know when a change will happen. This method is beyond the amount of effort I'm prepared to put in, so I'm lucky that I do have a degree of instinct.

[SPROGGS]

The dance is not just about getting your partner to wrap this way or that by moving your arms. Use your head, feet, legs, body etc.(or something)

Are we talking about dancing or wrestling here? I am also interested in what this ("or something") is as well

I know we are talking "Moves Toolbox" but has someone lost the thread....or just the toolbox?

I am sure I last saw it in the shed

SPROGGS

[SPROGGS]

Try listening to your fav songs and imagine how you would dance to it or how your fave dancer would. (or something)

I am trying hard to visualise how Gene Kelly would dance to "Sexy back"
No it's just not coming.........or do I mean Matthew Kelly ? No! That's not coming either....

SPROGGS

[martingold]

As an industrial electrician i believe in taking as few tools to the job as possible otherwise you end up being so laden with tools you cant do the job properly

[SPROGGS]

I'm not a fan of army dances. For a start I find the boots hard to move in ... Taxi for one please...

Dan

Hi Dan.....Can you make that a taxi for two

[SPROGGS]

For the Candyman track which seems very fast to me,

I usually need oxygen after it....It's around 170 BPM...

The secret is to join it halfway through.....or Hide when you hear the opening bars

SPROGGS