Southport Jive Weekender Poll

[Filthy Monkey]

When you buy a Big Mac in Southport, Brighton or Berlin they are always the same....Is that what you mean by "More Choice"

No, but I expect a difference between Wimpy, BK and McDonalds. All that's happened here is that Ceroc have taken over the venue that JA have traditionally used. Haven't you read the posts?! Keep up, man They are about to annouce new venues and dates for their weekenders, so you will have more choice than you can shake a stick at!

[David Bailey]

This forum currently has 3,201 members.

3,202 now (Including 10 in the past days, who apparently joined specifically on the base of this kerfuffle )

Which one of us, specifically, are you talking to, Sproggs!?

You, obviously.

[Filthy Monkey]

3,202 now (Including 10 in the past days, who apparently joined specifically on the base of this kerfuffle )


You, obviously.

Must be. My insecurity simply shines through, especially on the dance floor!!

[Lee Bartholomew]

Are you that insecure?

I think he is talking to all of us as a collective.

[dave the scaffolder]

Aye aye sport fans JA will come back from this minor setback and offer something better and amazing, of this I have no doubt.

Ceroc has introduced dancing to the masses and thousands of people have learnt to dance in the Ceroc method, of this I have no doubt.

Personally I like JA and I like Ceroc.

Am I the only person on this Ceroc Forum who is thinking to meself....More choice every venue must raise its game to attract dancers.

Is this not a good thing.

I run a small scaffolding co and get screwed by my competitors on a daily basis.

The world is not all warm and fuzzy, but a cut throat world of competition with people and organisations constantly improving their product and nicking good ideas to make more money.

All we can do is keep the engines warm and the weapon systems on line keeping a constant state of combat readiness. I am not voting because this is business, good or bad, it is business and like war there aint many rules involved.

DTS XXX XXX

[Wen]

Yet again we see Ceroc steamrolling their way to UK domination. In the end it will be BAD for dancers and you will all pay dearly. Sadly this time they have shafted Jive Addiction (Jon & Wes) who have worked really hard to get the Stockport Weekenders where they are today. The trouble is that if Ceroc get a sniff of an independent organiser making a success of something they decide they want a piece of the action - So here they go again trampling all in their path as they had previously done with Franco and other organisers.

Jive Addiction have taken weekenders to new heights by using their skills to understand the market and give dancers what they want.

We have now lost another excellent independent weekender venue to the Ceroc Franchise. Ceroc are stifling the dance entrepreneur and have yet again demonstrated they are unable to use their own initiative to create/develop their own events/venues instead they prefer use dubious practices to crush others. This is really bad news for all UK Dancers so who is next?

The individuals from Ceroc responsible for this dance disaster should be ashamed of themselves, and in future use their own expertise (if they have any) to create their own weekends instead of the insidious way they steal the existing dates and venues of independent organisers. In the end they will squeeze the pockets of every dancer who supports them. I for one will not be one of them.

My view is that Ceroc are the McDonalds of dancing so we are all going to end up with dancing Indigestion. Monopolies are never any good in the long run, and again Ceroc have again demonstrated avarice.

Finally I would like to thank Franco, Jon & Wes & the Rockbottoms team for the service they have done for us all, and hopefully continue to do so. By making Dance Weekenders and Holidays such great fun with new and groundbreaking ideas and events.

Sproggs, it is good to read an intelligent comment from someone who understands what is going on and has their eyes open. Your comment was spot on. Don't people realise that it is a case of independents without the money behind them being put out of business by a fat cat? Of course, a franchise with pots of money can afford to put on weekenders and even make a loss if they need to because we all want something for nothing so we all go to the cheap weekenders. It doesn't take long for the independents to go under and for Ceroc to put up their prices. We then have no choice! It's a simple concept. And has it escaped people's notice that Ceroc have a very limited way of working...a very limited dance style...a limited group of teachers and DJs who God forbid may want to play music or teach outside Ceroc...and if you want a limited weekender with only one style (let's all look like teapots and hold our eggs ladies) then go ahead and support the Ceroc fat cats. It is not about whether the weekender will be good or not, it is about whether what is being done is right and whether you have the balls to vote with your feet or just be a mug and do what's good for your wallet in the short term without opening your eyes to the long term effect. We (there are a lot of us out here) want healthy, fair competition and choice. I for one will not be going to any of Ceroc's weekenders but I would if I thought they were playing fair. And yes the comment about them being insecure was spot on. Why else do they need to try to poach? Surely they are good enough and experienced enough, not to mention wealthy enough to fight fairly and still win. There are a lot of experienced dancers out there who can make a difference...just vote with your feet! And don't forget to tell Ceroc, Pontins and Jiveaddiction how you feel.

[dave the scaffolder]

Am I the only person on this CEROC SCOTLAND FORUM thinking the measure of Cerocs resolve is being clearly shown by allowing the above post on its forum?

Ceroc has allowed some right derogatory posts on here.

DTS XXX XXX

[Lee Bartholomew]

Sproggs, it is good to read an intelligent comment from someone who understands what is going on and has their eyes open. Your comment was spot on.

I thought the exact opposite but hey ho.


What do JA do at their weekenders that is so different from ceroc? They get some of the best independent teachers in to teach and some of the best indy DJ's in the blues room. Other than that it is pretty much the same.

Ceroc, whether people like it or not, lead the way in MJ. Most indy jive organisations copy them, whether they realise it or not. How many indy jive companies teach the semi circle or play the same music as Ceroc do? A very good percentage. In fact, there are very few of us Indy jive organisations that dare to do something different from Ceroc. Why? Because Ceroc have a winning formula that everyone wants to imitate.

I'm not pro ceroc, nor am i anti. JA are not ceroc clones and will raise the bar once again in 2009. That can only be a good thing.

[SPROGGS]

Competition is healthy .

Yes I agree 100% with you on this Lee

If a UK takeover of weekenders by Ceroc leads to more choice for dancers then good....But just having more of the same is NOT Choice!

History has proven that when a monopoly takes over it leads to increased prices and a poorer service...

[Wen]

In response to DTS...Don't think you're getting how passionate people are about this! There are other threads about the Ceroc/Southport issue on here and the overwhelming feeling is one of complete disappointment and anger. Sorry Dave but think you're in a minority!

And about Ceroc's resolve?! They have thicker skin than a rhino...well, they would have to behaving as they do!

[Lee Bartholomew]

Yes I agree 100% with you on this Lee

If a UK takeover of weekenders by Ceroc leads to more choice for dancers then good....But just having more of the same is NOT Choice!

History has proven that when a monopoly takes over it leads to increased prices and a poorer service...

Which is why there should be alot more co-operation between organisers.

If Ceroc was to come down this way (currently a greenfield area) I would help them find a venue, busk etc, but I would always look at building my Org up so they didn't take over.

Why? Because they would get more people in to dancing and therefor my club, but I would be wary of them trying to push me out.

JA's weekenders would not have (and will not be) as successful as they are without Ceroc. How many people that go to them started out dancing at Ceroc, or have been taught by a teacher that started at Ceroc?

[dave the scaffolder]

Don't think you're getting how passionate people are about this! There are other threads about the Ceroc/Southport issue on here and the overwhelming feeling is one of complete disappointment and anger. Sorry Dave but think you're in a minority!

And about Ceroc's resolve?! They have thicker skin than a rhino...well, they would have to behaving as they do!

I am in a minority if the minority feeling is that this offers dancers more weekends and more dancing opportunities.

I have allready stated i love the JA weekends and I love the Ceroc weekends.

Everybody in business develops a thick skin.

This Ceroc Forum is allowing a heated debate, most of which is raging against it, seems like a fair and healthy response from Ceroc to me.

JA will IMHO come back with an alternative which will be nothing short of spectacular and continue to offer a service at the top of the game, as they allways have done.

JA is just too good too not too. However in the last couple of years Ceroc has really got its act together and offer some excellent weekenders and freestyle.

All of this is only good for us the dancing punters, this is of course only my humble opinion.

DTS XXX XXX

[SPROGGS]

Which is why there should be alot more co-operation between organisers.?

Lee... Please can you play another tune....

There is already Co-operation between organisers in East Sussex...

Anyway back to topic....

Good luck to John & Wes with whatever you decide to do... Just watch your backs! as the "High Council" is watching your success with envy.

[Caro]

..I, as a paying punter really want to know in advance, from both organisations, what i'd be getting for my money?

Not just, 'it'll be better... wait and see, blah blah'

With the current choice of events in the UK, France and the the US, I'm certainly not going to book an event on the basis that 'there will be one international couple' present.

And in any case I'm waiting to see what JA comes back with before taking any decision on Southport - I know I will not go to January, though.

I don't think there's anything insecure about operating a business to the best of your ability and that's exactly what the Ceroc organisation is doing.

hmmm. Why does it feel so much like Ceroc have 'stolen' JA events and work, then ?

[Steven666]

Sadly this time they have shafted Jive Addiction (Jon & Wes) who have worked really hard to get the Stockport Weekenders where they are today.

Either I'm missing something or that is just a

[djtrev]

I have only ever been to 2 weekenders,one at Camber and Southport was the other.It opened my eyes to what is out there for Mj'ers to enjoy.Fantastic atmophere,exciting and exhilerating dancing to some of the best music anyone could wish for.Hopefully I will get a chance to go to another weekender regardless of who is running it.Location and cost will be my only concern.
What has transpired over the last day or so with regard to Ceroc/JA at Southport is apparently what business is all about.There is nothing I can do about it except accept that it has happened and move on.BUT try as I might there is just that little part of me that still says what a shitty way to do business.

[David Bailey]

Am I the only person on this CEROC SCOTLAND FORUM thinking the measure of Cerocs resolve is being clearly shown by allowing the above post on its forum?

Nope

Ceroc has allowed some right derogatory posts on here.

Mostly by you

Ooh, look, a post with no real content. How unusual in this thread.

[SPROGGS]

Either I'm missing something or that is just a

YES you are missing something....

But Sadly so am I, a working brain cell....

We all make typos in the heat of the moment, over issues we feel passionate about, but most people overlook these errors and omissions unless they want to score a cheap point....

[SPROGGS]

They are about to annouce new venues and dates for their weekenders, so you will have more choice than you can shake a stick at!

Good Grief...they are dusting off the Senior members on this one..

I think you are missing the point here....They would'nt have to announce new venues and dates if "Ceroc" had'nt done the dirty on them now would they.....

Do keep up

[David Bailey]

I've noticed that a few people have put comments on the lovely FB group, saying that their posts have been deleted from this forum, with the statement that the moderating team are a group of jackbooted self-pleasurers, just on the verge of invading Poland.

To the best of my knowledge, no-one has moderated any thread to stop people spouting off. And that should be fairly obvious from the free range of feelings expressed in this and the other thread.

And, I personally am a little annoyed that people are spreading lies about censorship. Although, obviously, not the jackboots, which I think are quite fetching.