Edinburgh New Venue

[Scot]

First night at the New venue not ideal we had a massive influx of people which the venue was not big enough to accomodate.

It should be fine for thursday which is a quieter night usually.

For Tuesday we will look at another possible venue which is a bit further out of town however it is bigger. Alternatively we will think about a third night.

Please bear with us as we make this transition unfortunately it is not easy to find City centre venues and we were a bit spoilt with Marcos space and air conditioning

Thanks for your paitience.

Scot

[CJ]

A good post, Scot.

Yes, a third night would make sense (as a punter), but it's up to the decision makers...

It's funny: it's actually a really nice venue. But not designed to take the numbers that were on a Tue at Marco's.

Thinking about the early days in Edinburgh: The City cafe, The Uni place nr Salvation Army (can't remember the name) and such like, then the Masonic lodge shines. Am glad I wear kilts, tho... some of the guys looked really uncomfortable dancing with their trouser leg rolled up!!! ahem, moving on...

Bottom line... Edinburgh dancers were spoiled with a place like Marco's (for all it's faults) and there are very few venues like it around the country, never mind in Edinburgh.

Good luck, in getting it all sorted...

[killingtime]

Originally Posted by CJ

Yes, a third night would make sense (as a punter), but it's up to the decision makers...

Though, of course, everyone might still show up on a Tuesday anyway making it a bit of a crazy night. It was busy and though carpet isn't ideal to dance on moving those tables (as was done on one side a bit later) will probably help a bit.

Originally Posted by CJ

It's funny: it's actually a really nice venue. But not designed to take the numbers that were on a Tue at Marco's.

I generally liked it; it will take a bit of getting used to but I think it's because Marco's has been the only venue I've regularly known for the last couple of years.

Originally Posted by CJ

Am glad I wear kilts, tho... some of the guys looked really uncomfortable dancing with their trouser leg rolled up!!! ahem, moving on...

It was pretty warm (though I've been in warmer).

Originally Posted by CJ

Bottom line... Edinburgh dancers were spoiled with a place like Marco's (for all it's faults) and there are very few venues like it around the country, never mind in Edinburgh.

Is that code for "Edinburgh dancers like to moan"? Hey; the venue isn't perfect but it seems a good choice and, hopefully, the couple of main issues can be addressed in some way or another (big fans or something and clearing space or balancing numbers) will keep it a really good night. So I appreciate what Scot and his team have done and look forward to what happens in the future.

[2leftfeet]

Scot
Tuesday has kinda lost its sparkle.
What made it worth the 130 mile round trip was, the teaching was good, the company was good and the seats were hard....well it meant that you were forced to get up and dance!!!
Also with so many people on a Tuesday, would I be correct in saying 250ish??? if you could not see the teacher directly you could always look at the reflection in the mirrors.

The new floor was miles too short, at rough pace it was only a fifth the size or Marcos. The seats way too comfy too!

I know your task is not easy, but might it be easier to get the use of a school for teaching on a Tuesday night. I know that would mean there was no bar, but Im sure most people are there for the dancing and not booze!!


I like many other people have commitments on other nights so to add an additional night might work for a few, but I'm afraid not fo me.

Just a few thoughts, not a moan!!
2LF

[Scotch Bonnet]

Originally Posted by Scot

For Tuesday we will look at another possible venue which is a bit further out of town however it is bigger. Alternatively we will think about a third night

Out of town.....Fab,I hear Bonnyrigg/Dalkeith area would be ideal !!!

[dep]

I don't have access to the data on attendance for Tuesdays, but I would estimate the numbers that turned up were similar to a number of recent Tuesdays.
The new venue should never have got on to a short list, it was obviously too small.
Even if it had twice the floor area it would still be too small.

The customers were queued up/seated/standing around waiting for a space to dance. A friend estimated 50 unable to dance.

As far as I could tell none of the beginners on the night stayed for the freestyle. I suspect they were intimidated by the crush for dance space.
I further believe they will be lost, never to return.

I found it less than enjoyable trying to constantly avoid banging into/standing on/ kicking fellow customers. The lack of space ruined a good night.

Shona, our teacher for the night, did her best to keep her chin up and support her organisation, "learning to dance small steps is a good skill" and I admire her loyalty.

As for the heating being on when we arrived, the lack of adequate ventilation, and the speakers breaking down, in my opinion it can be summed up as a disaster.

ps,
just as well the Jam House is closed to the public on Mondays and Tuesdays.
pps,
I registered today, just to be able to post these comments.

[spice1]

Regarding the mild comments aired above, it has to be said, and lets not kid ourselves on, the situation that hundreds of Cerocers found themselves in last Tuesday night at the proposed new Ceroc venue at Shrubhill Masonic Hall was frankly shocking !!

Regretably the goodwill built up over many years between Edinburgh Cerocers and Ceroc Ltd. has surely slipped and may well take a while to recover as the night progressed and the nightmare of the inappropriateness of the venue unfolded.

I, for one, amongst many, have no desire ever to return to that venue, and I regret the disappointment of the night still lives on !

Yes ! that was how bad it was !!

Starting with the odour of apparently stale urine from the carpets at the entrance, it went rapidly downhill from there …
.. with the nightmarish and frankly dangerous overcrowding on the tiny dance floor,
.. the squashing in of hundreds of persons during the intermediate class on a floor fit for around forty,
.. the unhealthily stale air in the place,
.. the claustrophobia and overpowering heat,
.. the dancing on carpet,
.. the headache and feeling of nausea extending even into the following day,
.. the knowledge that £7.00’s were taken for the privilege, a disgrace, really,
.. and with the mix of competition for dance space, unavoidable accidental collisions and a busy bar in the area with cheap alcohol flowing, surely it is all a recipe for future trouble, which is certainly not what I would want to see at Ceroc !! .
…. and to excuse the above by saying that other local venues are not easy to find !! Well, Edinburgh played host during the Festival last year to 31,500 performances and 2050 shows in 250 venues, so surely with putting effort into some research, a bit of knocking on doors, (asking Cerocers for suggestions would not have gone amiss) and some negotiation, then suitable places would surely have surfaced .... and hundreds of us would be a whole lot happier today.

There, that’s it ! .. rant over !!

[Dance Demon]

Originally Posted by spice1

…. and to excuse the above by saying that other local venues are not easy to find !! Well, Edinburgh played host during the Festival last year to 31,500 performances and 2050 shows in 250 venues, so surely with putting effort into some research, a bit of knocking on doors, (asking Cerocers for suggestions would not have gone amiss) and some negotiation, then suitable places would surely have surfaced .... and hundreds of us would be a whole lot happier today.

There, that’s it ! .. rant over !!

And therein lies the problem......during the Festival Ceroc would lose such venues for around a month. That was the reason for moving from St Stephens.

[Aleks]

Originally Posted by Dance Demon

And therein lies the problem......during the Festival Ceroc would lose such venues for around a month. That was the reason for moving from St Stephens.

I'd prefer to be squashed for a month in the summer than suffer all year round.
St Stephens was my first Ceroc venue and I loved it. There was no bar, but as a virtual tetotaller that wasn't an issue for me.
I don't know what the solution is. The Masonic Halls are by far the prettiest venue Edinburgh's ever seen, but it really was cramped and warm on Tues. With a regular turnout of around 150 and a floor that was cramped with 60 on during the beginners class it's going to be a real struggle to keep people's interest in the next few weeks while this gets sorted.

[Little Black Dress]

hmmmm....I'm reserving judgement until I've been tonight. But, from what I've heard both on and off the forum, I'm a little apprehensive

St Stevens was my first venue too, and it was great. Who needs a bar? Go to the pub afterwards where you can enjoy a drink (alcoholic or not) and a chat whilst you cool down

[Scot]

To Spice1 and Dep if I am correct I believe you are associated so hopefully I will be able to catch you both next time I see you.

To all as I indicated in my first post I appologise that the venue is smaller than Marcos and we did not anticipate the number. Unfortunately the numbers on Tuesday have risen in January to in excess of 150 people. At the time I secured that venue the average was about 107.

As said we are looking into resolving the problem so if you could bear with us for a couple of weeks hopefully we will have another alternative for you.

With regard to issues of heat, airflow, speakers etc we have resolved those.
Not sure the cheap alcohol will really be a problem most Cerocers do not drink heavily.

[dep]

Hi Scot,
I am completely independent of Spice1.
There is no complicity here.
I do not even know who Spice1 is.

[jlg]

Hi, this is the 1st time I've posted anything, prompted by Tuesday's disaster.

I know it's difficult to find somewhere big enough for us but I'm afraid I'm not paying £7 to dance on the carpet!! I have been coming to ceroc regularly for 4 years sometimes twice a week and right now I don't want to come back. This hall was obviously going to be too small.

A third night doesn't help - we need lots of partners, that's why we come!

We don't need a bar - we drink water.

There's already talk of a ceroc boycott.

OK, enough negativity...

Why don't we all now get our thinking caps on and try to find somewhere ourselves - then offer suggestions to Scott. I've already spoken to a cerocer who knows 2 night club owners, clubs don't open till 10 or 11pm so they have empty space before then.

It's our ceroc so come on people!!!

Maybe you could have asked us before Scott - there are a lot of us with lots of contacts and ideas.

[Monty]

I haven't been yet so I'll reserve judgement. I'm just wondering what's going to happen to party nights as this venue is clearly unsuitable. As for the apparant overcrowding; fire regulations strictly limit the amount of people allowed inside a venue so this shouldn't really have been a problem. Were people turned away at the door because they'd already reached capacity?

[Monty]

...and I agree with Killingtime: a third night won't necessarily make the Tuesdays or Thursdays any quieter. In fact I remember how dead Monday nights used to be - wasn't that why they were cancelled in the first place?

[2leftfeet]

Monty no thefire regs were not breached.
If you take the Building Scotland Regulations and treat it as an assembly hall as it has no fixed seating you are allowed 2 persons per square metre.
However if you look at two people dancing you need a minum of 4 square metres.
It is the actual size of the dance floor that is the problem. the floor must be approx. 10x20 200 square metres. If you require 4 per couple, then 50 couples on the floor at a time max!!!
So Scott's pre Christmas calculation was not far off, however I think that there has been in excess of 160 people on a Tuesday night so 80 couples!!!
2LF

[Little Black Dress]

Well, Last night was a lot better than expected, but certainly not because of the venue....The venue is the kind of place you go to for a social/drinking night - not for dancing. The floor really only comfortably allowed for 10-15 couples or so. It was also a very sticky floor which spoiled things a bit.

It was lovely to see Franck and Sheena there - Sheena played a really good set of tunes - thanks for that. A lot of rumours going around re: Scot selling the franchise. Seems Franck has it now which in my opinion can only be a good thing as it will mean Scotland is one big happy family now (I really don't know the whole story, so sorry If I've got it wrong but that's what I believe has happened).

The other good thing is that alternative venues are being investigated - suggestions were being asked for - so hopefully we'll only be in this place for a few weeks. I'm not sure a third night would make things better. People have things happening on other nights and possibly can't change them, so will carry on going to ceroc on the nights they already go...

I'll be watching these pages keenly to find out what happens next

[Dance Demon]

Originally Posted by Little Black Dress

A lot of rumours going around re: Scot selling the franchise. Seems Franck has it now

Erm no he doesn't. Franchise is now the property of Mike Ellard....

Originally Posted by Little Black Dress

(I really don't know the whole story, so sorry If I've got it wrong but that's what I believe has happened).

No, You don't, and perhaps you don't really want to, as it's not very nice.

[Little Black Dress]

Originally Posted by Dance Demon

Erm no he doesn't. Franchise is now the property of Mike Ellard....



No, You don't, and perhaps you don't really want to, as it's not very nice.

Sorry again if I got the wrong end of the stick. Like I said, they were rumours, but as Franck and Sheena were there, maybe assumptions were made (by quite a few people) where they shouldn't have been...

Who's Mike Ellard?

Maybe someone would like to fill us all in on what has really happened?

[Little Black Dress]

Originally Posted by Little Black Dress

Who's Mike Ellard?

Doh! Have just googled him, thought I'd heard the name before....