frodo wrote:
Less so than in the WCS world ?
When you were learning to walk who taught you not to bump into people / things?Gerry wrote:The only times that I have seen Floorcraft being taught in a workshop / lesson is when I have voiced concerns over the dangers of bad floorcraft onm the WCS scene.
Personally I think it is something that needs to be brought up on a regular basis
Firstly, judging from the average battle to move around Tescos on a Saturday afternoon, the answer is "no-one"bigdjiver wrote:When you were learning to walk who taught you not to bump into people / things?
Market demand. It's why seducer workshops are overflowing, but you can't give away workshops on posture.bigdjiver wrote:It is also a bit contradictory to warn against travelling moves and yet teach them.
The problem is, the people who don't have common sense will ignore a few quiet words. Because they don't have common sense.bigdjiver wrote: I think common sense and a few quiet words with those that don't have it may be the right approach.
bigdjiver wrote:When you were learning to walk who taught you not to bump into people / things?
It is also a bit contradictory to warn against travelling moves and yet teach them. I think common sense and a few quiet words with those that don't have it may be the right approach.
In what way?Gerry wrote:When I asked our teachers to teach a workshop on floorcraft it was totally diferent to how I thought it would be done.
David Bailey wrote:In what way?
In the Scorch Aftermath thread RobD calls it defensive dancing ... good terminology ... I agree no one enjoys defensive dancingmarcusj wrote:if you have one like that next to you you can give them extra attention but have 3 or 4 and it's almost impossible, well not impossible to keep you and your partner safe, but pretty much impossible to enjoy the dance as that's all you can think about !
In my experience, it's more difficult to dance MJ around a stationary couple than one moving around. Funny that, but it seems to be true.Steven666 wrote:I always amazes me when people think that others around them dance staionary. Just because a space was there 2 seconds ago, doesn't mean it's still there now...
Is this really, in general, a very common problem? I've had my fair share of minor bumps over the years but at the venues I dance at but there are very very few people who show a lack of floorcraft. It's not something that's explicitly taught at my main venue (unless they cover it during the beginners' workshops, which I never did) so I'm surprised to hear that people don't always pick it up as well as they do here.marcusj wrote:I can't believe the number of places I go where I am surrounded on all sides by leads not looking at what's going on around them at all, if you have one like that next to you you can give them extra attention but have 3 or 4 and it's almost impossible, well not impossible to keep you and your partner safe, but pretty much impossible to enjoy the dance as that's all you can think about !
You don't really need to dance around them though - just don't collide with them. I've never seen anyone have a problem with pillars, for example...David Bailey wrote:In my experience, it's more difficult to dance MJ around a stationary couple than one moving around. Funny that, but it seems to be true.
I generally find floor craft at many MJ events (from local freestyles to natioonal events) pretty atrocious. The biggest sin is poor awareness of dance space - knowing where you and your partner and everyone else around you is going to be at the end of a movement before you initiate it. In MJ, that's pretty hard, given that the dance often lacks a basic structure (by that I simply mean, in a lot of cases, you can't tell which line a dancer will step back on when they being a return).meghann wrote:Is this really, in general, a very common problem?
I've seen a lot of people unnecessarily standing on a dancefloor, taking up the dance space of people actually dancing (or walking across it). If people can do that, then you can safely assume they have no concept whatsoever of floorcraft. I've seen this happen quite frequently.meghann wrote:there are very very few people who show a lack of floorcraft.
If it's not taught, then it's safe to assume it's not known. A lot of floorcraft is simple decency, which I think most (except for the standers) seem to have. The rest - in my experience - at MJ is learnt by experience. It generally works OK for most people, but it doesn't work for all people and it can be improved for everyone.meghann wrote:It's not something that's explicitly taught at my main venue (unless they cover it during the beginners' workshops, which I never did) so I'm surprised to hear that people don't always pick it up as well as they do here.
Ah, but pillars don't suddenly materialise in the middle of the dance. If a couple literally stops dancing, they close off a whole section of possibilities for movement, which affects everyone dancing around them.straycat wrote:You don't really need to dance around them though - just don't collide with them. I've never seen anyone have a problem with pillars, for example...
I'd never thought of it that way around.David Bailey wrote:Ah, but pillars don't suddenly materialise in the middle of the dance. If a couple literally stops dancing, they close off a whole section of possibilities for movement, which affects everyone dancing around them.
As I said, it's strange and illogical, but it does seem to be more difficult to dance next to stationary couples.
I know, it's weird, isn't it? I get the same thing, I'm often just standing there doing AT-y things and I get bumped-into.Gav wrote:I'd never thought of it that way around.
Usually, when we've frozen for a break or stopped for a little wiggle/shuffle and some mong throws their partner into us with all their might, I'm thinking F.FS! We weren't even bloody moving!
On the other hand, it's much easier to dodge a stationary bullet.marcusj wrote:It's plain common sense, it's much harder to hit a moving target !
I suppose I see it a little differently - dancing a lot of Lindy and blues, I'm used to stationary dancers, and I'm used to dancers hurtling across the floor at warp speeds. You learn to see dancers, see where they are, and estimate what they're doing next. Which isn't that hard for a stationary couple.David Bailey wrote:Ah, but pillars don't suddenly materialise in the middle of the dance. If a couple literally stops dancing, they close off a whole section of possibilities for movement, which affects everyone dancing around them.
Floorcraft skills are different in different dance forms. Most of the MJ floorcraft I had learnt was useless in AT, because AT is progressive and MJ is not.straycat wrote:I suppose I see it a little differently - dancing a lot of Lindy and blues, I'm used to stationary dancers, and I'm used to dancers hurtling across the floor at warp speeds. You learn to see dancers, see where they are, and estimate what they're doing next. Which isn't that hard for a stationary couple.