So what exactly IS West Coast Swing? (WCS)

[Gadget]

BTW: where does "Blues" fit into this equation? I really don't know where the line is between slow MJ and blues... but perhaps that's just my dancing

{in the context of slower tracks being easier to WCS to than MJ to}

[ducasi]

BTW: where does "Blues" fit into this equation? I really don't know where the line is between slow MJ and blues... but perhaps that's just my dancing

{in the context of slower tracks being easier to WCS to than MJ to}

At a recent *eroc event the DJ announced "here's a good track to WCS to!"

Sure enough it was a slowish R&B type number... A lady asked me to dance – I warned her I didn't know jack about WCS, but she said she didn't either, but we could see how we get on.... So I danced my Ceroc to it, just a little slower than normal. We did fine.

It wasn't an obvious "blues" track though, and so I don't think it would have worked so well for blues dancing.

But even before I learnt to dance Ceroc I didn't really like this kind of music as it was too slow to dance to. Even though I can now dance to it, I still prefer a nice fast song to dance to. Just the sort of guy I am... :shrug:

[Geordieed]

: so the 'good' MJ dancer is roughly equivelent to an "average" WCS dancer - not so much because the dances are different, but because the way they are taught/what is taught moves the starting end of the scale up a bit.

Making comparisons between the two dances is not easy to do and to be honest is not very fair. The standard of even the lower level WCS dancers in competitions in America is so high. WCS is going through the steps that any dance trying to get started in a new country will go through. Although this is not the first time people have tried to get the dance going. We also have to remember that WCS as a weekly event in the south/London was launched around 2 years ago when David and Lily started teaching in Bisley. Just to take the basics on board takes a long time. It's also key to note that it takes quite a while too of actually learning WCS and dancing it socially before you can appreciate what the dance is about to comment on it. What is seen and what is felt are important to the dance and often not the same.

The only clear judgement that could be gained out of learning a little from weekend events or a couple of months of classes would be to know if you like it or not. After speaking to people who have tried and failed to put some of the 'flashy' WCS competitions moves into the competition dancing they have come to realise how good these guys really are.

[Mr Cool]

I would define WCS as dancing MJ in a slot with footwork using a basic 6 beat and 8 beat format.
Does anybody agree with me this dance can be danced using triple steps or single steps?
I think this dance fits in nicely with MJ and Lindy you can mix and match it. I also think it lends itself to be danced to a wide range of music including quite fast swing if you revert to single steps. What do the experts think

[El Salsero Gringo]

I would define WCS as dancing MJ in a slot with footwork using a basic 6 beat and 8 beat format.
Does anybody agree with me this dance can be danced using triple steps or single steps?
I think this dance fits in nicely with MJ and Lindy you can mix and match it. I also think it lends itself to be danced to a wide range of music including quite fast swing if you revert to single steps. What do the experts think

You can define WCS as that if you like, just like I can define an elephant as a big grey cow with a long nose. It doesn't make it true though, does it?

[spindr]

You can define WCS as that if you like, just like I can define an elephant as a big grey cow with a long nose. It doesn't make it true though, does it?

Just so - you remember that the crocodile done it tho?

SpinDr

[Dance Demon]

I also think it lends itself to be danced to a wide range of music including

Yep....even to a bit of " contemporary easy listening"........

[Geordieed]

I would define WCS as dancing MJ in a slot with footwork using a basic 6 beat and 8 beat format.
Does anybody agree with me this dance can be danced using triple steps or single steps?
What do the experts think

Come and join one of the many weekly classes sprouting up in the South. You can answer the question yourself then. I know you would be most welcome Mr Cool.

[Mr Cool]

Yep....even to a bit of " contemporary easy listening"........

Absolutely Im sure you will be in great demand

[Mr Cool]

You can define WCS as that if you like, just like I can define an elephant as a big grey cow with a long nose. It doesn't make it true though, does it?

So how would you define WCS ?

[El Salsero Gringo]

So how would you define WCS ?

I don't feel the need to define WCS, merely to learn to dance it; but if I did I wouldn't start with MJ and work from there: that's as un-useful as trying to define Modern Jive in terms of Waltz. Listing some (but not all) of the differences is simply misleading.

By the way, WCS moves can be 6, 8, 10, 12 or any bigger even number of beats.

[Mary]

By the way, WCS moves can be 6, 8, 10, 12 or any bigger even number of beats.

Or 4. Remember the 4 count basic leading the lady off again with a syncopated step? I seem to remember you were able to lead this rather well.

M

[Mr Cool]

I don't feel the need to define WCS, merely to learn to dance it]

Thankyou what I mean by a 6 or eight beat format is that is the basic form of the dance I would expect the dance to include longer and shorter moves.
I observed the American WCS world champion doing a nice whip on 4 (hollywood style lindy) that fitted in nicely ( note they took out the triple step) so whats your opinion on triple steps is it possible to do WCS single stepping?is it still WCS? and do you believe WCS can be danced to a wide range of music?

[Gadget]

I don't feel the need to define WCS, merely to learn to dance it]
But it's the only point of reference that some of us have. How else would you describe it to those that don't have the opertunity to learn it?

[ChrisA]

But it's the only point of reference that some of us have. How else would you describe it to those that don't have the opertunity to learn it?

I agree with ESG on this one. Any description, even if 100% accurate, would still conjure up different images in people's minds. And any one of those of us WCS beginners would be very unlikely to be able to describe it 100% accurately.

For instance, I might say that it's more slotted than MJ. It would be true, but misleading, cos you can still move off, or even rotate the slot, in certain circumstances.

I'd get a DVD or download some movies of it.

But best of all would be to do some, taught by someone that really emphasises the connection and teaches you how to actually achieve it.

[El Salsero Gringo]

But it's the only point of reference that some of us have. How else would you describe it to those that don't have the opertunity to learn it?

I'm happier to describe the ways it differs from MJ than to define it. It looks a bit like you might imagine MJ, but it's more slotted, and the basic foot patern is often six or eight-count moves beginning and ending with a triple step. It feels very different to MJ to dance: the music is often slower and the lady is sent ('batted'?) backwards and forwards from one end of the slot to the other rather than shepherded round the floor, as far as I can tell.


By the way, an elephant is like a cow, only much bigger and has a long manoeverable nose. And there are these things called tusks.

[Paul F]

Thankyou what I mean by a 6 or eight beat format is that is the basic form of the dance I would expect the dance to include longer and shorter moves.
I observed the American WCS world champion doing a nice whip on 4 (hollywood style lindy) that fitted in nicely ( note they took out the triple step) so whats your opinion on triple steps is it possible to do WCS single stepping?is it still WCS? and do you believe WCS can be danced to a wide range of music?

Footwork is only taught as an aid to understand the structure of the dance.
In reality you could dance a whole track without even a hint of a triple step.
When it was originally created WCS was known for its nimble footwork. The participants in those days did triples and more so

If you watch somebody like Jordan F and look at his footwork you will see he does random patterns including glides (moving using only one foot) which is just nuts
As long as you maintain a good structure including good communication with your partner you can do with your feet what you want Well, almost

[ChrisA]

By the way, an elephant is like a cow, only much bigger and has a long manoeverable nose. And there are these things called tusks.

Ah, I've heard about tusks. They're like the cow's horns, right?

[Mary]

Ah, I've heard about tusks. They're like the cow's horns, right?

Nah. Horns are on the top of the head by the ears, tusks are down by the mouth on either side of the long thing that waves around looking for a bun.

I'll have a go at describing WCS It's a slotted dance but the slot can be as wide as you make it. There are rules and conventions - which can then be broken. It it a 'grounded' dance in that the head stays level and even (there's no bouncing up and down with the body, or hands for that matter), and all the movement is in the lower body and the feet skim the floor which also means the foot and ankle are articulated more in the triple steps rather than skipping them.

There is oodles of technique to learn which, when mastered, gives the most fantastic connection and opens the doors to some of the most fabulous musical interpretation and connection with your partner you can ever imagine.

Oh, yeah, and WCS has some of the coolest moves

M

[Geordieed]

If you watch somebody like Jordan F and look at his footwork you will see he does random patterns including glides (moving using only one foot) which is just nuts
As long as you maintain a good structure including good communication with your partner you can do with your feet what you want Well, almost

Jordan doesn't do just what you could call random footwork. There is a formula/structure to it. The more I learn about footwork and what you can do with it then the more you can make sense out of the footwork that you see from the pro's from the States. The dancers being taught over in the UK aren't at a level yet to take on board the more complex footwork found within the dance. After a few months of trying to learn the basics I started off from scratch again after a class with Jordan when he described how to use what part of your foot with what sort of weight when doing the basics. It made it so much harder but made it feel hugely better. After some time of going through an instructional video by Mario Robau, an authority on footwork, I have realised how much more there is on the subject of footwork. I would love to do alot of what I have seen even at a lower intermediate level but know that I am not ready for it. Getting to the end of his class and the advanced stuff looks an absolute universe away.

Have a look some of the other dance professionals from America (like my favourite couple Brent and Kallese Key or watch Kyle Redd) and it will have your head in knots trying to take in what they are doing. It will make sense in time though.


If people thought trying to describe what's WCS seemed easy until actually having a stab at it, just get onto the subject of footwork. There is so much more to learn first.