Bare Minimum Moves.

[spindr]

I think that you have it the wrong way round --- it's the guys who get bored with their own moves

If I know 20 moves that's all that I end up dancing all night, even if I dance with 100 different ladies. If a lady dances with 100 different guys she gets the chance to dance (100 * 20) moves Plus, it's quite difficult to surprise yourself with a choice of move (although not impossible if your memory starts playing tricks).

I think the popularity thing is just that if you teach 100 guys a lesson -- probably half of them will try some of those moves later in freestyle -- hence the sudden rise in popularity, etc.

So, what's the popular move this week that's come back from Beach Boogie ladies?

Neil.

[michael]

Imagine the ladies got to lead for the week to show off their new moves. Me thinks i would be following right out the door and all that spinning too

I wonder how many of us guys would go dancing if we were to be led round the dance floor by the female. I wonder how many arguments we would have too. "Your B....Y fault dear its your leading. It would expose most of us for how bad we dance (probably).

Any female who is willing to show me a new move is welcome to try at any time (hint hint). We have the option to learn it or bin it thereafter.... see its great being a guy

[DavidB]

Originally posted by spindr
it's the guys who get bored with their own moves

I agree. I might do moves that not many other people do (at least until I taught a few in Perth!), but I do them all the time. The only move I've never got bored of is the yoyo

I really enjoy it when a lady doesn't do what I expect, because I have to think of something different. But if the lady feels she hasn't done what I've led, she says sorry!

At times like this, I just do something I'll never be any good at - golf!!

(And I know it's late. But I don't have to go to work tomorrow, and it is the first day of the American Football season, so I'm staying up until 5:00 )

[Gadget]

Originally posted by Yogi_Bear
An interesting thread - though I have skipped the majority of it I haven't come across any mention of the 'First Move' as a basic modern jive or Ceroc essential.

The "first move" entrance and exit are the basis for almost all couple dances; a "Salsa" hold, a "Ballroom" hold etc. so there are millions of variations from this move - from your standard push-spin's and turns to walks, dips, seducers,...
It's not difficult to dance a whole song using variations of it.

On a seperate note, stealing inspiration from Jiveoholic's map (mentioned earlier on this thread) I have produced a similar one, {that the kind man is hosting on his site} here.
Where in his map the arrows are linking moves to get from one move to another, I have seperated the linking moves from the actual moves themselves to give (what I hope) is a fairly clear route map between all of all the basic moves I can think on.

Let me know what you think.


{BTW David B:I really enjoy it when a lady doesn't do what I expect, because I have to think of something different. But if the lady feels she hasn't done what I've led, she says sorry!
I know exactly where you're coming from }

[Yogi_Bear]

Sometimes I wonder whether it's necessary to learn anything other than the First Move and some of its variations. Add some breaks and hesitations and you could dance to almost anything. Learn some footwork to go with it and......you could soon be doing something like a Lindy Turn.

Yogi

[Yogi_Bear]

IMHO the only three Ceroc beginners moves you need to know are the first move, the basket and the sway (and a way to link the sway to the lef-righ hold moves).
What do you think?

[Graham]

Originally posted by Yogi_Bear
IMHO the only three Ceroc beginners moves you need to know are the first move, the basket and the sway (and a way to link the sway to the lef-righ hold moves).
What do you think?

Actually you'll also need a way of linking the basket/first move to your sway, as the standard form of both finishes L/R. Sticking to beginner moves, you could do a first move push spin instead. You could also just do a hand swap on a turn/return, but I've always thought this looks as if you've made a mistake, and hardly ever do it in freestyle. (Perhaps that's just because that's when I use it of course!)

[Beowulf]

Wow.. that really is the bare minimum.. or should I say the Yogi Bear Minimum

[DavidB]

Originally posted by Graham
You could also just do a hand swap on a turn/return, but I've always thought this looks as if you've made a mistake, and hardly ever do it in freestyle.

I do this all the time. I'll even change my hand at the start of a move - eg starting a yoyo with my left hand, and changing to my right when the lady steps in.

The only time you get problems doing this is when the lady won't let go of your hand! And it only looks noticable to anyone else when you make your leads so big that they can see them on the other side of the floor. Keep your leads small, and people will watch the dancing instead of the hands.

David

[xSalsa_Angelx]

Originally posted by Yogi_Bear
IMHO the only three Ceroc beginners moves you need to know are the first move, the basket and the sway (and a way to link the sway to the lef-righ hold moves).
What do you think?

Hmmmm typical carrot cruncher ..... my boyfriend only uses these moves to, rather boring i think, oh he's a carrot cruncher too>!!

The problem is getting him to step back when i step back, and he tends to rush his moves a bit quickly.

Ive found that i like footwork and he does not give me enough time do do this.

basket, sway ... it is too much of a begginner move and it looks too begginer on the dance floor, am not an expert but i do prefer some of the varied moves such as basket, comb, looks much better.

[Graham]

Originally posted by DavidB
And it only looks noticable to anyone else when you make your leads so big that they can see them on the other side of the floor. Keep your leads small, and people will watch the dancing instead of the hands.

Interesting point: I do spend time watching good dancers, such as yourself, and I do notice when you do things like that, because I'm watching very closely. But other times my attention has been drawn to it when I was observing more casually, and now I think about it this probably was down to the lead being large.

[Gadget]

Originally posted by Yogi_Bear
IMHO the only three Ceroc beginners moves you need to know are the first move, the basket and the sway (and a way to link the sway to the lef-righ hold moves).
What do you think?

Thinking on it even more, I don't think you actually need to know any moves themselves - you only need to know the connecting moves...

• how to collect and release a lady's hand (& swap hands)
• how to turn a lady with either hand
• how to send a lady into a spin
• how to collect a lady to your side

... a basket starts by collecting a hand, then turns the lady and collects her to your side.
... a first move starts by collecting the lady to your side with the left hand.
... a sway starts by collecting the lady to your side with the right hand.

Everything else from there can be broken into one of the above "moves", so if you can lead all of the above then it's only timing, positioning, finding the music, watching for other dancers and personal hygene you need to worry about. { }

[bigdjiver]

I would tackle the bare minimum moves question from the view of enabling the leader to dance with a follower that has never done it before.

Hand jive, basket and basket walk around. All two handed moves with lots of control. Man spin, lady spin, and side to side, which can all be led with minimum knowledge from the follower, although the side to side can involve the follower standing there bemused as the leader moves from side to side.

The basket walk-around gives the opportunity to hide the gaps in dance knowledge with a bit of social chat.

[Jon]

Don't foget the comb, another great move for a bit of social chatting

[bigdjiver]

Originally posted by Jon
Don't foget the comb, another great move for a bit of social chatting

I agree on the social chat aspect, but I was trying to limit the number of moves, and avoid educated ones. The natural reaction of most beginners is to step back if they have not been taught not to. (Well, it is with me :-< )

Simon Selmon has called moves that both partners have to know 'educated' moves.

[Jon]

Ah well thats what the mans spare hand is for. And if she still steps back then why not step forward so the man's following for 1 beat, prehaps add on a little 90 degree twist and we are no longer doing educated moves but improvising.

Humm, not sure if that is a ceroc move but sounded nice as I wrote it will try it out tonight. Thanks Bigjiver your an inspiration.

[Yogi_Bear]

Well, at least no-one seems to have suggested the catapault as a bare minimum move. As you spend most of the move facing away from your partner I don't think it exactly promotes communication.

Yogi

[bigdjiver]

Originally posted by Yogi_Bear
Well, at least no-one seems to have suggested the catapault as a bare minimum move. As you spend most of the move facing away from your partner I don't think it exactly promotes communication.

Yogi

I minimise the behind my back moves on principle for this reason. The catapult would be high on the list for the next stage.
My first selection were all on the basis of the follower being firmly led, and not requiring a lesson. The catapult, if led with the ladies right hand firmly clasped usually leads to a moment where they do not know what to do. Eventually they take the left hand and the move gets completed. To my mind this gives them the confidence that they can work it out, and do a move that seems more complex, has a WOW! factor.

[Boomer]

I’m just starting to realise that having a stock of moves is not as important as having a way of connecting the moves together. A few moves, fairly well connected, does seem to go a long way. This works to such an extent that even ‘I’ had 2 wimmin look surprised when I admitted that I ‘wasn’t as confident as I looked’ on the dance-floor, but was in fact bricking it. To clarify, THEY thought I looked confident, not me. I normally find the following sequence to be very workable: “may I?” – “Of course” – “thank you, I’ll have a Bud please”- gulp-gulp “May I be so bold as to ask again?” – “of course” – “thank you” gulp-gulp....then hit the dance-floor running on the first beat of the next song (preferably with a partner..but ask first!) and don’t stop to think until the last bar of the song. Apologise for any shattered toenails and repeat from the beginning.

If anyone thinks this is just a joke, come along to the canteen and witness this beered-up force of nature :sorry . I’m not being entirely facetious Beowulf, I am starting to realise that the best way to ‘do it’ is just to relax, smile and laugh when you fluff it. People are only watching to see how MUCH you dance, not how well.

[Neil]

Originally posted by Boomer
I am starting to realise that the best way to ‘do it’ is just to relax, smile and laugh when you fluff it.

Ah, you have achieved enlightenment, Grasshopper.

As a fellow drinker & dancer, let me offer this well-meaning advice: the key thing is to know when to stop. A couple of Buds will work wonders, but too many and you risk suffering from "hotshot" syndrome: you will think you're the world's greatest dancer, but sadly your performance will not match your self-belief and you may fall flat on your face (literally and metaphorically). I'm sure you've figured this out already . Incidentally, I'm not always that great at following my own advice.

(You could always forget the Buds and try some proper beer - oh, sorry, you're in London of course. Better stick to Bud).



Neil